iD bought by ZeniMax

[Aradreth]

Title says it all really.
from here (http://kotaku.com/5302060/id-software-bought-by-bethesda-parent-company-zenimax)
Doom, Fallout, Oblivion, Wolfenstein, Carmack, Howard... all in one company.

Two of the most acclaimed game development studios of all time are joining forces. ZeniMax Media, parent company of Fallout 3 and Elder Scrolls development studio Bethesda Softworks, announced today that it is purchasing legendary Doom and Wolfenstein studio id.

In an interview with Kotaku, id co-founder John Carmack, id CEO Todd Hollenshead and ZeniMax CEO Robert Altman said the purchase will change none of the principles or principals of id and Bethesda but will allow id to grow like it never has before. The purchase does not affect plans for previously announced games from id that are slated for release through other publishers, including the Activision-backed Wolfenstein and the EA Partners-planned Rage.

Why did id sell?

"We're really getting kind of tired competing with our own publishers in terms of how our titles will be featured," Carmack said. "And we've really gotten more IPs than we've been able to take advantage of. And working with other companies hasn't been working out as spectacularly as it could. So the idea of actually becoming a publisher and merging Bethesda and ZeniMax on there [is ideal.] It would be hard to imagine a more complementary relationship. They are triple A, top-of-the-line in what they do in the RPGs. And they have no overlap with all the things we do in the FPSes."

Hollenshead said ZeniMax's acquisition will allow id to grow its internal teams, staffing up the groups working on the next Doom — which will now be a ZeniMax game — and the Quake Live team, for starters.

The goal, explained Carmack, is for id to handle all of its own IPs. "We can build the pipeline and have a regular pipeline of releases."

Altman described the deal as a "win for fans of id." He said the deal came about when Hollenshead approached him. ZeniMax had been looking to acquire developers and wanted id, but didn't know it was available until approached. The merger had been in the works for months, according to the men on the call today.

In a press release for today's news, Altman laid out a vision for a robust id: "We, along with many others, consider id Software to be among the finest game studios in the world, with extraordinary design, artistic and technical capabilities. They have demonstrated, repeatedly, that rare ability to create franchise properties that are critical and commercial successes. Our intention is to make sure id Software will continue to do what they do best – make AAA games. Our role will be to provide publisher support through Bethesda Softworks and give id Software the resources it needs to grow and expand."

No co-developed games are planned at this time. But, they joked, getting those Fallout bobbleheads into Rage would be fun.
press release can be seen here (http://www.zenimax.com/id.htm)

[Melcar]

http://img530.imageshack.us/img530/808/cybertoddler.jpg (http://img530.imageshack.us/i/cybertoddler.jpg/)

[yogi_berra]

http://img530.imageshack.us/img530/808/cybertoddler.jpg (http://img530.imageshack.us/i/cybertoddler.jpg/)

I think iD would remember the groin shot.

[deanjo]

Damn, I'd rather see a merger of iD and Bioware.

[KDesk]

Will they still publish id Tech 4 under the GPL?

[Aradreth]

Damn, I'd rather see a merger of iD and Bioware.
Bioware is owned by EA...

Melcar that's pretty close to what I was thinking.

[deanjo]

Bioware is owned by EA...

Still applies. Considering Zenimax has never been kind to linux and now Carmack is no longer head dude future ports of even iD's games look bleak.

[Dragonlord]

Lucky me I did not put my money on an ID Tech engine. That can burn a couple of people if this one turns out bad :(

[Raven3x7]

Still applies. Considering Zenimax has never been kind to linux and now Carmack is no longer head dude future ports of even iD's games look bleak.

I dont recall them being hostile, more like indifferent. In any case afaik Zenimax doesnt put its companies on a tight leash. Oblivion was one of the very few recent games i recall that doesn't have copy protection on it's retail discs as well.

[Aradreth]

I dont recall them being hostile, more like indifferent.
Yeah that's the impression I got as well.

[TotallyEpic]

I dont recall them being hostile, more like indifferent. In any case afaik Zenimax doesnt put its companies on a tight leash. Oblivion was one of the very few recent games i recall that doesn't have copy protection on it's retail discs as well.

Did you even need the CD Key for Fallout 3? I just remember using it for GFW Live.

[xav1r]

Will they still publish id Tech 4 under the GPL?

Good question, Im asking that myself too. Since they are now owned by Zenimax, and I dont know about them, but Bethesda does not care and probably has contempt about linux/FOSS, so it's a big question mark now. I dont know if it's relevant, but one time I emailed Bethesda's dev team's blog about possibly re-releasing Daggerfall for linux or releasing its source code, they quickly replied "We will NOT be releasing Daggerfall as a freeware or any other type of release at anytime." Looks like they didnt read any part of the question besides the word release. :rolleyes:

[AdrenalineJunky]

Still applies. Considering Zenimax has never been kind to linux and now Carmack is no longer head dude future ports of even iD's games look bleak.

from the official zenimax press release:

"id Software will continue to operate as a studio under the direction of its founder, John Carmack. No changes will be made in the operations of id Software in the development of its games. All the principals at id Software have signed long-term employment contracts, assuring they will continue in their roles developing games at the studio."

[kraftman]

I think iD would remember the groin shot.

+1

Good question, Im asking that myself too. Since they are now owned by Zenimax, and I dont know about them, but Bethesda does not care and probably has contempt about linux/FOSS, so it's a big question mark now. I dont know if it's relevant, but one time I emailed Bethesda's dev team's blog about possibly re-releasing Daggerfall for linux or releasing its source code, they quickly replied "We will NOT be releasing Daggerfall as a freeware or any other type of release at anytime." Looks like they didnt read any part of the question besides the word release.Bethesda is console pro company. They also messed up Fallout which is now more FPS than cRPG, but it's still a great game (thanks to Fallout universe). They probably don't even have idea what Open Source is or they're just doing us favor by no releasing DF, because Daggerfall is better known as buggerfall. Bethesda is definitely far from being 'By gamers for gamers' company. They don't even care what fans expect from their titles. They're rather marketing creatures.

Obsidian + iD this would be great.

[yogi_berra]

from the official zenimax press release:

"id Software will continue to operate as a studio under the direction of its founder, John Carmack. No changes will be made in the operations of id Software in the development of its games. All the principals at id Software have signed long-term employment contracts, assuring they will continue in their roles developing games at the studio."

Do you really believe press releases? Buy-outs almost never go the way the press release states, just look at what happened to Bioware yesterday. They were dissolved and merged with Mythic to form EA's new RPG division.

If this buy-out goes the way id's site states it might be a good thing as id will basically be self publishing, but until someone at id says something publicly about source releases and ports, I wouldn't plan on anything.

[Raven3x7]

Do you really believe press releases? Buy-outs almost never go the way the press release states, just look at what happened to Bioware yesterday. They were dissolved and merged with Mythic to form EA's new RPG division.

If this buy-out goes the way id's site states it might be a good thing as id will basically be self publishing, but until someone at id says something publicly about source releases and ports, I wouldn't plan on anything.

Ahem, EA basically placed Mythic under Bioware's supervision is what happened. More here http://forums.bioware.com/viewtopic.html?topic=683419&forum=41

On-topic i don't see much in common between EA and Zenimax, the latter seems to have a much more hands-off approach regarding their studios. It might affect the open-sourcing of future ID engines though, but who knows at this point, probably not even John Carmack.
Now Bethesda is a very good company imo that supports their games throughout their lifecycle not to mention the exceptional modding tools that they release with their games that helped create the excellent modding community they have. Granted Oblivion felt more like a sandbox rather than a real game, but add some of the community mods and the game world becomes a lot less stale.(I believe the game is that way by design). In any case playing Bethesda games on the console forces you to miss out on half the fun, so i wouldn't call that console friendly. They just develop for consoles as well these days as they are such a big market. As for Obsidian , besides beeing published by Atari their track record is anything but exceptional(particularly when talking about bugs). NWN2 is much more focused and less ambitious game than than ES3 and FO3, and build on established tools. But despite that it was a lot more buggy on release and still is buggy to a large degree.

[deanjo]

NWN2 is much more focused and less ambitious game than than ES3 and FO3, and build on established tools. But despite that it was a lot more buggy on release and still is buggy to a large degree.

NWN2 was a complete rewrite, everything from engine to tools were built from the ground up for it (or at least essentially re-wrote).

[xav1r]

Ahem, EA basically placed Mythic under Bioware's supervision is what happened. More here http://forums.bioware.com/viewtopic.html?topic=683419&forum=41

On-topic i don't see much in common between EA and Zenimax, the latter seems to have a much more hands-off approach regarding their studios. It might affect the open-sourcing of future ID engines though, but who knows at this point, probably not even John Carmack.
Now Bethesda is a very good company imo that supports their games throughout their lifecycle not to mention the exceptional modding tools that they release with their games that helped create the excellent modding community they have. Granted Oblivion felt more like a sandbox rather than a real game, but add some of the community mods and the game world becomes a lot less stale.(I believe the game is that way by design). In any case playing Bethesda games on the console forces you to miss out on half the fun, so i wouldn't call that console friendly. They just develop for consoles as well these days as they are such a big market. As for Obsidian , besides beeing published by Atari their track record is anything but exceptional(particularly when talking about bugs). NWN2 is much more focused and less ambitious game than than ES3 and FO3, and build on established tools. But despite that it was a lot more buggy on release and still is buggy to a large degree.

I myself liked oblivion, but im not a dedicated rpg fan. Many established long time fans of the genre didnt like oblivion, saying it was too generic, too console friendly, fps with rpg elements and not an actual rpg, etc. I liked vanilla oblivion, but many say that it needs 30 or more gigs of mods to be a good interesting game. Techincally wise, the game is buggy. You can't alt-tab in oblivion without it crashing, for example. Like it was said, it's unclear what will the future be now for both of Zenimax's wholly owned studios, bethesda and id. Do they now own all id's source code? I hope not.

[kraftman]

@Raven3x7

Don't even talk about bugs please. When I play Fallout 3 it sometimes returns to desktop few times per hour. Oblivion doesn't even start (some people recommend fresh xp install especially for it xd)! Bethesda makes the most buggy games... Fallout 3 interface reminds me consoles and each B game is more simplified then previous one (when comes to their fantasy titles and RPG system) which is console like behavior. NWN2 is definitely more ambitious then ES3 - wonderful D&D. However it sometimes reminds me hack and slash ;) Btw. ES3, ES4 and F3 are great games in my opinion.

[Setlec]

Will they still publish id Tech 4 under the GPL?

well we will have to wait until rage would be release (next year) to see a possible GPL release. since Wolfenstein is using idtech4 v1.4 (the v1 means the original code (doom 3) and 4 means Id's 4th game with code modification).

[Wyatt]

If it means Bethesda can use idTech and stop paying for Gamebryo, this might be a major step up for Elder Scrolls. Then again, I still feel that Morrowind was much better than Oblivion and Oblivion With Guns.

[yogi_berra]

@Raven3x7

Don't even talk about bugs please. When I play Fallout 3 it sometimes returns to desktop few times per hour. Oblivion doesn't even start (some people recommend fresh xp install especially for it xd)! Bethesda makes the most buggy games... Fallout 3 interface reminds me consoles and each B game is more simplified then previous one (when comes to their fantasy titles and RPG system) which is console like behavior. NWN2 is definitely more ambitious then ES3 - wonderful D&D. However it sometimes reminds me hack and slash ;) Btw. ES3, ES4 and F3 are great games in my opinion.

Are you seriously expecting depth and substance from a company owned by Jerry Bruckheimer?

[kraftman]

Are you seriously expecting depth and substance from a company owned by Jerry Bruckheimer?

I do not know the guy ;)

[yogi_berra]

I do not know the guy ;)

He's the brain trust behind CSI, CSI: New York, and CSI: Miami. Long running American television shows that are known for a lack of depth and substance. Movies he's produced have also been known for being shallow and lacking of any substance.

If you need a picture of all that is soulless and wrong with producers, he is your man. And now his game publishing company owns id software.

[xav1r]

Where do you get that jerry bruckheimer owns Zenimax? I can't find any info about that.

[Ex-Cyber]

I don't think he owns it, but he's on the board of directors. The board pretty well screams "entertainment industry" (the CEOs of CBS and MGM are on it as well), which honestly makes me wonder if the main point was to somehow secure movie/TV rights for future id games.

[AdrenalineJunky]

He's the brain trust behind CSI, CSI: New York, and CSI: Miami. Long running American television shows that are known for a lack of depth and substance. Movies he's produced have also been known for being shallow and lacking of any substance.

If you need a picture of all that is soulless and wrong with producers, he is your man. And now his game publishing company owns id software.

while he has worked on alot of aweful stuff, he's actually worked on some very good movies as well.

sad as it is to say, i think he understand consumers - and as awefull as i think CSI and all the spinnoffs have become, they've always done pretty well in ratings.

all that aside - anyone claiming the Elderscrolls series as a whole is lacking in depth and substance is crazy.. at least in my opinion.

[Dragonlord]

Morrowind is good, the rest not so much with Oblivion falling out of the scale at the bottom.

[AdrenalineJunky]

Morrowind is good, the rest not so much with Oblivion falling out of the scale at the bottom.

i definately think morrowind was the best, and though i don't really like the whole level scaling direction they went with oblivion, i still think it is a good game.

[Dragonlord]

The level-with-you is one problem, the cranked up combat system another. In Morrowind you could actually pull off different attacks ( stab, slash in two ways ) and it had an influence ( stab with speer is great, slash with speer is weak ). In Oblivion is like rolling a D20 with 20 being the only value where you actually do what you want it to do :/

[AdrenalineJunky]

while that is true - i actually thought the combat system in oblivion was overal better then morrowind

having a block button instead of random chance, as well as being able to cast spells mid combat were huge improvements.

[Dragonlord]

These two things indeed are a good additional. But what does a good addition help you if the entire rest ( the majority of combat ) is send to hell? That's my main problem. That and unbalancing. In Morrowind you can play well as all kinds of characters which is after all what role playing is all about. In Oblivion you can only be successful as one kind of character as all others get bum fucked especially in higher levels where enemies are ridiculously lasting. Kills the role playing part since you have to play one sided or else you get nowhere without mods ( and therefore cheating ).

Besides... Horse Armor ( DLC ) killed games... and that shit grew on the Oblivion dunghill :(

[Raven3x7]

These two things indeed are a good additional. But what does a good addition help you if the entire rest ( the majority of combat ) is send to hell? That's my main problem. That and unbalancing. In Morrowind you can play well as all kinds of characters which is after all what role playing is all about. In Oblivion you can only be successful as one kind of character as all others get bum fucked especially in higher levels where enemies are ridiculously lasting. Kills the role playing part since you have to play one sided or else you get nowhere without mods ( and therefore cheating ).

Besides... Horse Armor ( DLC ) killed games... and that shit grew on the Oblivion dunghill :(

Since when are mods cheating?

[yogi_berra]

sad as it is to say, i think he understand consumers - and as awefull as i think CSI and all the spinnoffs have become, they've always done pretty well in ratings.

Yes, but is that reflecting on the content of the CSI shows or the fact that what the other channels are airing is worse by comparison?

all that aside - anyone claiming the Elderscrolls series as a whole is lacking in depth and substance is crazy.. at least in my opinion.

:) Call me crazy, I don't see depth or substance in the Elder Scrolls games, just hack and slash sandbox action. There is not enough character development for me to develop an emotional attachment to either the story line quest or the world that I am supposed to be saving, unlike Bioware's games which usually have excellent character development which allows for an emotional attachment to the game world.

[AdrenalineJunky]

Since when are mods cheating?

depends on the mod.... some very much are cheating, some are good additions to gameplay

Yes, but is that reflecting on the content of the CSI shows or the fact that what the other channels are airing is worse by comparison?


valid question, though honestly, i think alot of people really are into entertainment with absolutely no depth... ratings would seem to strongly support that notion.



:) Call me crazy, I don't see depth or substance in the Elder Scrolls games, just hack and slash sandbox action. There is not enough character development for me to develop an emotional attachment to either the story line quest or the world that I am supposed to be saving, unlike Bioware's games which usually have excellent character development which allows for an emotional attachment to the game world.

well, everyone is entitled to thier own opinions, i personally think morrowind has a great story line.

These two things indeed are a good additional. But what does a good addition help you if the entire rest ( the majority of combat ) is send to hell? That's my main problem. That and unbalancing. In Morrowind you can play well as all kinds of characters which is after all what role playing is all about. In Oblivion you can only be successful as one kind of character as all others get bum fucked especially in higher levels where enemies are ridiculously lasting. Kills the role playing part since you have to play one sided or else you get nowhere without mods ( and therefore cheating ).

Besides... Horse Armor ( DLC ) killed games... and that shit grew on the Oblivion dunghill :(

i suppose its a matter of whats important to you, to me the negative of oblivions combat system didn't bother me that much.

unbalancing is a very good point though.... and there are quite a few others to be made, which is why i completely agree morrowind is a far better game.

[Raven3x7]

depends on the mod.... some very much are cheating, some are good additions to gameplay


valid question, though honestly, i think alot of people really are into entertainment with absolutely no depth... ratings would seem to strongly support that notion.


Sure some mods are cheats but that's not how i understood what dragonlord said. Oblivion is rather boring vanilla. It really becomes a good game only with some of the better mods. Also i dont really like the setting/story. Morrowind was so much better at that.

As for the second part, couldn't agree more. It's obvious a lot of ppl just want shallow storytelling

[AdrenalineJunky]

i think you may be misinterpretting what he's trying to say

Kills the role playing part since you have to play one sided or else you get nowhere without mods ( and therefore cheating ).


i take that to mean "unless you use mods in a way that is cheating, you cannot get anywhere unless you play a certian character"

though personally i'm not sure i would characterize using mods to balance the game as cheating, rather i'd say its fixing the game. as long as you don't take it too far, obviously.

[Dragonlord]

Yes, the mods make Oblivion better but they can't save it. Some mods are cheats though like for example the bag of holding ( infinite inventory space ), Akatosh riding mod ( toast entire armies and if you get enough fly into the air since in the original game you can't go airborne so the AI doesn't know what to do ), various species mods giving you ridiculous stats turning you nearly godlike. Morrowind had that too of course. I played it too with the Ryukaissen species but only after I made it through with a legit character since the Ryu has immunity to fire and having some other rather "good" stats and skills. Picked it though just because it's a Ryu ( even though a furry one but let's forget about that quickly ) not because it makes the game too easy. For Oblivion though there are tons of mods which are overpowered even more than for Morrowind if my mind doesn't trick me. That's in general what I meant with cheating.