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Thread: DRM Patches For Linux 2.6.27 Kernel

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by ethana2 View Post
    Scary and a little mean sounding maybe, but he /is/ right.

    The thing is, I think the DRM folks wanted to get their code into the next volley of major distros....
    Whether he right or he doesn't, in this decision, he should be more polite, IMO..

    Graphic cards manufacturers have comparable little profit from Linux owners share of market. And what ATI or Intel do currently for X, can be called "welfare" in some kind.

    I believe, that commiters really wanted to get some things to be fixed/updated ASAP.

    Maybe, they didn't understand "Merge window" clearly enough. But I still don't like what Linus said..

  2. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by mityukov View Post
    Whether he right or he doesn't, in this decision, he should be more polite, IMO..

    Graphic cards manufacturers have comparable little profit from Linux owners share of market. And what ATI or Intel do currently for X, can be called "welfare" in some kind.

    I believe, that commiters really wanted to get some things to be fixed/updated ASAP.

    Maybe, they didn't understand "Merge window" clearly enough. But I still don't like what Linus said..
    IMO you are partly correct with what you say. Still it is not only the world of graphic cards manufacturers. Yes, improvements in the DRM part of the kernel are a great thing since they speed things up. But they are also likely to cause problems and regressions since it is a big area of code that is critical for stability. If the merge window was really adhered it would be possible to maybe get a new kernel out in something like 6 weeks after the first rc. This is only occurring bugs and regressions need to be fixed and it is unlikely that many new ones are introduced by late merges.

    Yes, commiters want to see their work in the kernel ASAP. Still there is a reason for this merge window to speed up the general releases of new kernels. This is: many contributors are able to get their code into the kernel in this small merge window, why not all? If you look at the last three kernel releases you will see that the release of the final version was delayed due to regressions in late merges. Basically all of the rest was working nicely, there were just extra problems introduced by later merges. Without those the kernel would probably have been out at least two weeks, maybe even four weeks earlier.

    Adhering the rules will help and reward other contributors to the kernel by a faster release cycle. Since there are not only graphic card manufacturers working on the kernel, but eg manufacturers of embedded systems and the like. The kernel is not only about 3D graphics and their acceleration but also about all the other stuff the OS should offer like drivers for your mass storage devices.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saist View Post
    I read the thread and the response to Linus by Mr. Airlie:



    I think... Mr. Airlie is wrong about his statement. The fact is, the patches he's submitting are available. Anybody can take those patches and merge them into their own kernels.

    There should not be anybody then asking why Red Hat / Fedora ships with code that they can't ship, unless the code is proprietary. If the changes to the code are that dramatic and useful, vendors will simply include the code themselves, rather than waiting on an official kernel version.

    Then if the vendor won't include the code, there's nothing to stop the end user themselves from including the code.

    So, I'm not sure what Mr. Airlie is fine with. On the surface, it sounds like he's fine with proprietary code and keeping it locked away... I just can't imagine that being his intent.

    My guess is that Mr. Airlie didn't actually think about what he wrote back, instead trying to be cute and make Linus look bad while promoting his own product.
    You maybe didn't get the point: Airlie didn't talk about proprietary code.

    He said that most of the distros do not add those patches, and stay with a stock mesa/DRM from the kernel snapshot; and since kernel development doesn't take little time to release new versions, in Fedora you can find features that in other distros you can't see for months.

    This means that the answer of linus will be, for Dave, the sentence that explains why this happens.

    I think this is more coherent with what Dave said...

  4. #24
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    lol ive always loved torvalds replies and i also love the fact that im writing this post from my psp

  5. #25
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    Let me make the point that making a polite refusal is usually much more effective than cursing and insulting the person you are refusing.

    Linus's answer may be blunt, but I don't think it does a very good job of making his point.

  6. #26
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    i also love the fact that im writing this post from my psp
    and your point is...? what's so special on posting from psp?

    like linus himself once said - "i think of richard stallman as of a great philosopher. and he thinks of me as a mere engineer".

    engineers don't have good interpersonal skills :]

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by misiu_mp View Post
    Hmm, I ve seen Linus being jumpy like that before. Maybe he should do some anger managment or sing "Im so pretty" when the steam goes up.
    nope, just last week he was angry about the networking crew to send a mega-patch and told them that so late in rc-cycle big patches (outside of regression fixes) are inacceptable. And then David sends a mega-patch too.

    This is normal Linus-behaviour. And he is right.

  8. #28
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    Usual Linus; arrogant and offensive. I never liked him and it gets worse as time passes.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by RealNC View Post
    Usual Linus; arrogant and offensive. I never liked him and it gets worse as time passes.
    then you haven't really read his mails.

    Or the whole history. Just last week he lectured people in a lot of mails about patches. When, what. The first one was harsh, the others friendly. And this week David sends a mega-patch.
    How would you act in Linus' place?

    Yes, he often sends harsh mails - but after that he also sends nice helpfull mails in which he explains how to do it better.

    He has to manage a very big project. A lot of stuff has been explained a lot of times. People like David A. or Dave J. should know better than to send big patches at rc4. Harsh mails are normal.

    If you really want to read a bashing, look for Al Viro.

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