When Will UT3 For Linux Be Released?

[Dragonlord]

The initial major problem with 2k3 and 2k4 is how the physics fundamentally changed movement from UT99. The real breaker, though, is how terribly overpowered hitscan is. Once you've experienced "shock tape," it gets more and more painfully obvious. Also, the link gun is crap. UT3's problems, from what I've experienced so far, are mostly that the rockets are too good-- huge blast radius and damange.

I guess it's a matter of opinion, but I'm a bit confused why anyone would prefer the sniper over the LG: 40% More damage, arcs to hit other nearby enemies, no smoke trail left behind, negligibly slower refire, more ammunition.

I didn't have much time with it, but UT3 actually improves a lot of aspects of the gameplay. The movement is less gimmicky and you no longer have to boost-dash constantly to get somewhere fast (and it's less floaty, too). The Necris vehicles were pretty much all useless and some of the maps showed really poor design as far as path choice, though still better than Digital Extremes did.

Long story short, UT99 is still the best and looks like it will remain that way for years to come.

PS: Assault was totally in 2k4.

This is all good and nice but if you hit shit with the LG then all these added benefits help nothing. I did my testing back then with the LG and it has not even 10% hit chance. It's utter rubbish especially for a sniper junky like me. Granted the sniper in UT3 is less accurate and has a higher miss rate than the one in UT99 but the LG is just the pinnacle of worthlessness. Also they should reduce rocket strength but bring back multi-lock from UT99 ( and I don't mean lock 3 and then blast them uncontrolled but loading up to 6 and hold them until it's time to launch the party ).

Didn't remember an assault mode in 2k4. At least in the version I tested I could not spot one... duh.

[Wyatt]

This is all good and nice but if you hit shit with the LG then all these added benefits help nothing. I did my testing back then with the LG and it has not even 10% hit chance <snip>

Pardon? It's hit-scan. It draws a trace, a straight line in three-dimensional space from shot origin to mesh collision determined by current pawn facing. If the trace intersects the collision mesh of an opposing pawn, a hit is registered and 70 damage is inflicted, prorated by mutators, armour, and special attributes (such as head shot). Upon collision, I believe it's one to three auxiliary bolts of 64 units in length are spawned with random orientation originating from the collision point, each with the potential for 30 damage.

The details vary, but the sniper rifles, minigun secondary, stinger primary, enforcer primary, shock rifle, pulse/link secondary, redeemer explosion and a few vehicle weapons all operate on this principle.

If you hit, you hit: there is no "chance."

[Dragonlord]

Sorry, this is not the case. I had a pal standing still or moving linearly while I either aimed at the torso or head. In only 10% ( maybe a bit more ) the LG registered a hit otherwise it always missed. Testing then with for example a shock rifle yielded high hit rates. This is one of the reasons this game pissed me off because if I want to play some hit-chance based game I go play PoA... which is also a lot more fun.

And it's not the first time I did such hit-chance tests on games so I have my experience with it.

EDIT: What you describe sounds like the BFG from Quake. This one had such a system ( John-Woe I call this ). I can't remember a weapon in UT which uses this kind of splash damage. It's either a ray-hit or a sphere-hit ( Redeemer for example ).

EDIT:EDIT: I think we also don't talk about the same. Looks to me as if you equate "hit-chance" to a probabilistic test. That's not the problem here, it's allways 100%. The problem is that the hit-ray is jittered around the shot direction resulting in misses ( it doesn't hit where you aim ).

[Wyatt]

Sorry, this is not the case.

No, sorry, it is dead on. There's a lot of very good documentation directly from Epic on how the engine works as well as countless people that can corroborate this.

EDIT: What you describe sounds like the BFG from Quake. This one had such a system ( John-Woe I call this ). I can't remember a weapon in UT which uses this kind of splash damage. It's either a ray-hit or a sphere-hit ( Redeemer for example ).

I don't remember the exact behaviour of the BFG, having never been a big fan of Quake, but when the projectile component of the Redeemer detonates, it iterates through the active pawns and tests to see if a trace can be made. If it can, damage is done in five waves of greater and greater radius for 250 a shot (less fall-off) with a short delay between.

EDIT:EDIT: I think we also don't talk about the same. Looks to me as if you equate "hit-chance" to a probabilistic test. That's not the problem here, it's allways 100%. The problem is that the hit-ray is jittered around the shot direction resulting in misses ( it doesn't hit where you aim ).

But it isn't. I'm sorry, but there are no two ways about this. There are two major classes of weapon shipped in UT: projectile and hit-scan. Projectile weapons spawn discrete actors with their own physics and take time to reach their targets. Hit-scan weapons are a boolean trace to wherever you're pointing. With the exception of the high-ROF modes with the minigun, stinger, and enforcer, and the assault-rifle primary (which sucks), there is no induced inaccuracy on any hit-scan weapon.

If you were aiming at the enemy and fired, you hit: this isn't Battlefield 2. It's really that simple. :/

[zorroh]

You can play UT3 with newest Cedega, they recently released version 7.1

[tball]

You can play UT3 with newest Cedega, they recently released version 7.1

I don't wanna touch that game as long a native linux client isn't released. And if it is released, it doesn't have my interest.

[Svartalf]

You can play UT3 with newest Cedega, they recently released version 7.1

You know... The big problem with that thinking is that you're telling Epic it's just fine to do what they did when you do that. Each and every copy bought under these circumstances means you don't want a Linux version of anything. Seriously.

Each copy of a Windows title bought is contributing to a Windows network effect- which tells the studios there's not a Linux market and there IS a Windows one.

[Dragonlord]

No, sorry, it is dead on. There's a lot of very good documentation directly from Epic on how the engine works as well as countless people that can corroborate this.

I don't remember the exact behaviour of the BFG, having never been a big fan of Quake, but when the projectile component of the Redeemer detonates, it iterates through the active pawns and tests to see if a trace can be made. If it can, damage is done in five waves of greater and greater radius for 250 a shot (less fall-off) with a short delay between.

But it isn't. I'm sorry, but there are no two ways about this. There are two major classes of weapon shipped in UT: projectile and hit-scan. Projectile weapons spawn discrete actors with their own physics and take time to reach their targets. Hit-scan weapons are a boolean trace to wherever you're pointing. With the exception of the high-ROF modes with the minigun, stinger, and enforcer, and the assault-rifle primary (which sucks), there is no induced inaccuracy on any hit-scan weapon.

If you were aiming at the enemy and fired, you hit: this isn't Battlefield 2. It's really that simple. :/

Please read what I posted. A hit-scan ( correct term is ray-cast by the way ) yields a boolean result, this is correct, but the DIRECTION into which the ray-cast is done is random. Otherwise I would not have gotten this miserable hit ratios in my testings. Games like Q3A have no jittering on the ray-cast and therefore are always accurate. This is not the case here as otherwise I would have obtained a 100% hit rate which is not the case. It's a common trick done by developers to balance weapons by adding inaccuracy to strong ones or long reload times ( or small clips ). Here though they went too far turning the LG into a laugh-gun. At last in UT3 the sniper is a sniper again as it should be: powerful but slow.

[Odin]

@Dragonlord
Of course, UT99 is the best one. ^^

btw. dropping a game mode is not a plus point since you weren't forced to play that mode.

[Wyatt]

Please read what I posted.

Likewise.

There is no induced inaccuracy (which, for some bizarre reason, you've taken to calling "jitter") in the Lightning Gun as packaged in UT2003 and UT2004. I can assure you: everything you need to verify what I am saying is right out in the open and easily accessible without a commercial engine license. If you wish to continue to argue this point, you will need to unpack your files and show what code the entire development community has missed in the past five years. Really, though, the only explanation that isn't, "You simply cannot aim," is that you have high latency on your WAN connection.

PS: "Hit-scan" is an accepted domain term of players, modders, and many developers and could not be called "incorrect" in the slightest.