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Thread: AMD Releases Open-Source R600/700 3D Code

  1. #181
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlackStar View Post
    Well said!


    Exactly, and in fact it's needed much more than mpeg2 acceleration (XvMC). Problem is, we need 3d and Xv and a suitable API before H264 can be accelerated in the open drivers. We also need power management, because watching a video with your GPU howling is no fun.

    Not joking about the last part, either: my severely underclocked 4850 card consumes ~65W with RadeonHD vs ~30W with Catalyst when idle. This translates to a fan speed of ~4000RPMs (intolerable) vs ~2000RPMs (barely tolerable). (Yes, I'm going to add a big bad piece of copper and silence it, but the difference is significant.)
    if your trying to justify needing PM,Xv etc before we can get assisted video decode etc working ,No we dont, its assumed after reading here and doom9, that just like the nvcuvid library API part of cuda that doesnt use anything other than the blackbox ASIC VP2 (400 MHz powered VP2 Logic),that ATI's blackbox ASIC UVD ??Mhz ! does virtually the same low power drain and so uses virtually no power to access and use its potential just sat there idel or going full wack FIFO.


    OC people seem to think it doesnt matter right now and thats a massive ATI beancounter mistake for the long term as the word of mouth PR gravy train spreads and moves away from all things ATI video related.

    as NV seem to have put their beancounters in check on this easy assisted decoding/encoding matter, and are working really hard full stream ahead to push their Blackbox VP2 Logic VP2 Logic to any and all devs closed and open right now, it appears ATi wont have anything for you for at least months if your an open dev wanting to use and advocate UVD Logic today at least....

    VP2 Logic:
    badaboom
    http://www.cyberlink.com/eng/press_room/view_1994.html
    CoreAVC, AVCNV,FFMPEG etc....

    UVD Logic:
    AVIVO encoder, no not really, as currenty thats still only using the CPU for its encoding.
    ????
    ????
    Last edited by popper; 01-09-2009 at 10:53 PM.

  2. #182
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    popper, and you are thinking that everything is about hd content.
    It isn't. Earth to popper, most people don't care about hd.

    Most people care about noise. And with catalyst my 3870 is quiet (overall energy consumption 106W). On a vt, the fan howls unbearable (energy consumption 160W). As it does with r/rhd - which makes the open drivers useless for me.
    Most people care about 2d performance. Oh, they don't vote for it - but read all the complaints about non-snappy windows, slow scrolling, etc.
    A lot of people care about 3d. Because everything is 3d today.
    A lot of people care about xv - because apps like tvtime don't even run without it, others need a lot less cpu with it (xine, mplayer).
    But hd? Who watches hd content on a linux box? And what are the surces?
    x720 divx5 - is that hd? if yes - newsflash, that doesn't even get my cpu away from 1ghz...

  3. #183
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    Quote Originally Posted by energyman View Post
    popper, and you are thinking that everything is about hd content.
    It isn't. Earth to popper, most people don't care about hd.

    Most people care about noise. And with catalyst my 3870 is quiet (overall energy consumption 106W). On a vt, the fan howls unbearable (energy consumption 160W). As it does with r/rhd - which makes the open drivers useless for me.
    Most people care about 2d performance. Oh, they don't vote for it - but read all the complaints about non-snappy windows, slow scrolling, etc.
    A lot of people care about 3d. Because everything is 3d today.
    A lot of people care about xv - because apps like tvtime don't even run without it, others need a lot less cpu with it (xine, mplayer).
    But hd? Who watches hd content on a linux box? And what are the surces?
    x720 divx5 - is that hd? if yes - newsflash, that doesn't even get my cpu away from 1ghz...
    Earth to energyman

    your not thinking of the far larger end game here,or seeing the long term cause and effect for that matter, its common in many circles so your not alone OC....

    fact is the WORLD (is not just the USA) IS transitioning from Analogue to Digital right NOW, the world standard IS becoming HD thats true, and one day HD will be your generic SD OC.

    people are changing the worlds internet usage and Video streaming etc has/IS becoming the No1 bandwidth usage very quickly, people want to encode and decode this content and will buy and use whatever is available to them to allow this task, you agree?

    well just like adults stick to the food groups they learn to like in childhood, the very same thing happens in all walks of life, and that especially happens in the computer and internet markets, you agree?

    do you start to see the big picture here?, as NV get peoples attention in this early stage, they are securing longer term useage of their tools and APIs, while i assume ATI bean counters and middle management (as the boardroom guys cant be that daft missing such a fundimental flaw in their cost savings as the economic downturn hits can they?)cut costs in supplying UVD Logic API documentation manpower were it's required right now, as thats what the people buying the cards, and keeping the profits coming in want now....

    on the larger scale, as the economic downturn hits, people turn to their existing inhome entertainment and video, TV, DVD and newer HD kit rather than go out, theres a massive potential for new profits in cheap home/net entertainment HD Tech/SW that works, if your in the right place at the right time, NV seem to be there now, what about the others....

    make no mistake about it, its not just some tunnel vision HD thing on my part, but rather, trying to have people looking for and seeing the far bigger long term picture in all things IT i write about, and try and bring to peoples attention...

    as a secondary point, OC i would like all these things you point out too, but right now, the short term prioritys months/tears instead of weeks and days for UVD docs for the HW thats already on your installed shop shelf kit, so its available right now, but unusable due to lack of docs and will to write the working code examples internally ,and OC bean counters are holding things back, not authorising far more man power or overtime to push this thng through now its become clear UVD is a thing ATI customers have and want to use right now, instead of having to stand by, watching NV HW only apps appear around you.

    and again, if you want to talk about "energy consumption" and being green, as usual the main stream press get it all wrong OC, people dont care about saving the planet as much as, people DO care about saving real cash on their electronic energy costs.

    i like low power everything electronic, as it has the potential to then be run off a one time cost PV,micro wind, and distilled water Fual cells etc, local power stored in batterys for overnight use etc.... that saves me money long term with a one off cost, that i can perhaps offset by buying something extra power generating every other month, and get a grant at some point to pay it off..... bottom line, give me lower power netbook static CPU/GPU/MB,HD LCD,and wireless 11n/wimax access points/routers etc and i save lots later and get the jobs done i want to do now.
    Last edited by popper; 01-09-2009 at 06:50 PM.

  4. #184
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    so the world is 'going digital' and more hd content will pop up in the future.
    Yeah, that is nice. But that is in THE FUTURE. Not now. So there is plenty of time.

  5. #185
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    Quote Originally Posted by energyman View Post
    so the world is 'going digital' and more hd content will pop up in the future.
    Yeah, that is nice. But that is in THE FUTURE. Not now. So there is plenty of time.
    sure, theres plenty of time if your happy always taking the left overs and being at the end of the worlds food line....

    if you however want to keep some kind of reasonable income long term, you had better pull your socks up and get out there producing and flogging your goods, and building your good will....right now.

  6. #186
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    so tell me - how many bluray players are there for linux?

  7. #187
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    Quote Originally Posted by energyman View Post
    so tell me - how many bluray players are there for linux?
    as many as you can go out and buy OC

    plugging them in is easy,but making them work without docs is all together another matter....

    that would be a HW vendors not supplying drivers and docs OC but all linux users know that story all to well....

    your point being i assume you cant play BR disks direclty in linux....

    Ohh wait, thats another good reason to try and get UVD Logic HW assisted working code into the (linux) apps ASAP so you can rip your original payed for BR transport streams and transcode them to something you CAN use faster, or will YOU be using the NV tools for that job? , if thats what exists today probably, unless OC your going to have a word with your USENET connections and download it because you dont have the tools you need in your machine....
    Last edited by popper; 01-09-2009 at 07:39 PM.

  8. #188
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    em, you might want to read up on bluray. It was made 'unrippable' - and there won't be any open source bluray players ever.

    So - how many bluray players for linux are there?

    none.

    Will that change in the future?

    no,

    That leaves 'hd' digital tv - which is pretty much a joke, easily decoded and still far away and illeagally downloaded porn.

    So why do you want hd decoding again?

  9. #189
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    " It was made 'unrippable' " LOL, it appears its YOU that might want to go read up a little, (but thats OK as no one knows everything, weres the FUN in that) the doom9 threads are full of devs asking for BR 50M clips of problem BR Pro house encodes, go read that CoreAVC doom9 thread for one.

    tell that "It was made 'unrippable'" to the people ripping them right now, as their only option is to transcode the HD AVC/AAC inside the BR transport streams into another container for playback on the devices they have.....

    (were are YOU?)your 'hd' digital tv - might be a joke, the Uk's FTA HD BBC and others DVB-T and DVB-S(2) bitrates are fine and indeed seem to have set the standard all others world wide are measured against.

    notice too, i keep mentioning "transport stream" thats the defacto standard virtually all the worlds Digital content be it that oddball USA thing, DVB-* FTA/PFS, HD DVD/BR and soon enough the online streaming content will be using as the world also moves to TCP/IP packets for all things digital ,make no mistake .TS is as important if not more so than your old AVI and the VP2 Logic and UVD Logic already works with that TS standard OC.
    Last edited by popper; 01-09-2009 at 08:29 PM.

  10. #190
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    and dvb-t is just mpeg2 - which is decoded fine with even a cpu from the stone age.

    And bluray? it is just a matter of time until they revoke the hacked keys - and then you are back on square one. With a fundamental difference. Since the media industry has bought the politicians, the laws changed. Ripping dvds might be legal (because there is no copy protection), ripping bluray is not.

    So - where are we?
    HD is not important now or in the near future. Recent CPUs (everything in the last couple of years) have no problem with content up to 720p - and I have no other films here.
    2d is still not fixed - and is important. Every single second you are in front of your computer 2d performance is affecting you.
    3d is important because it is the 2d's backend
    and most important is power consumption. Because NOBODY wants to watch a film next to a card screaming at 4 sone

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