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Thread: High End RadeonHD 4850x2 with radeon drivers ride ...

  1. #1
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    Default High End RadeonHD 4850x2 with radeon drivers ride ...

    well, i bougth a 4850x2 in amazon (i was still happy then, i was young and naive too) so i proceed first with win7 rc1 (same vista crap with some bugifxes so far)only to test some new games like farcry2, and it was so nice this card power XD so i proceed later that nigth to my jaunty install and remove all nvidia drivers (now i slap myself everytime i have something bad to say about those god blessed drivers )and installed fglrx (big mistake btw) in resume everything is crappy/choppy/slow so i almost kill myself (damn 330$ and dont work in linux)so before RMA to get a 285 gtx, i decided to give a try with radeon driver(and put the gun back in to my desk). so my experince so far isbtw im a c++ dev any normal user would RMA instantly or shoot himself, but as as geek i decide the git path)

    *after experience a bit of procedure first
    -install kubuntu karmic koala rc2 + full update
    -add radeon crack ppa to your installation, only to forget about mesa git compilation and get kms kernel
    -then make a git clone to the latest snap of radeon driver, the one with radeon crack dont work because this card have the wrong PCIid in the driver. after the git clone go to PCIid file and add 0x9443 to 4850x2 list
    -the same bad PCIid is in drm too so this part im working on it cuz git drm fixes it the same way just changing the PCIid buuuuuuuut the ttm.ko dont load cuz of undefined symbols so i need a 2.6.31 staging kernel backport wich is still wip so far maybe today i got it modprobing

    ok experinces

    1.)2D performance: i managed to get a nicely EXA ligth speed fast(still waiting for some patching )dual desktop configuration, yes no crossfire X but 2 monitors each one rendered by a 4850 is very nice too, and yes no glitches so far, mmm i reminded me the nice Xi Graphics Ati driver
    2.) DRI: i have big hopes cuz software renderer is slow but it work very stable and it doesnt complain about anything + 4850 is supported so im very optimistic and only complain is wrong PCIid
    3.) Video: only need DRI to activate but even disabled video work quite well so i think DRI will only improve it
    4.) MultiHead: so far clone works good, still waiting to get DRI to play with xrandr and xinerama, but to get recognized both monitors at the right resolution and bring them on is far more than fglrx could do, so big hopes here too
    5.) CrossFireX: missing but in fglrx doesnt do a big job either so no big deal.but maybe AMD will release this doc eventually or maybe we can think on a parallel method to get multiGPU togheter, dunno something like a joined framebuffer + some kind of GPUMP at drm lvl so to linux this is a 1600 unigpu with 2gb ram and not 2 4850 and this way we can avoid any kind of game side optimization, ahh just an idea

    so basically im very pleased of the lvl of quality of the GIT radeon driver so far and if DRI works as expected at least to get my wine L2 installation + compiz working ill be as happy as i can ever be

    update: about one gpu per monitor need more testing to see if both chips are active, i thought their was because both monitor render so fast in 2d, but with dri active later ill be sure if both go ative XD and about DRI asking in dri-devel yesteday finally got my hands on staging kernel, my pciid is still missing but thats easy to add so now i have to figth with mkpg which in ubuntu always provide a corrupted initrd so i cant boot staging or maybe is the XIP memory stuff in kernel config, mmmm tonigth ill get it done hopefuly.
    update2: well with bridgman help i got drm/dri installed in a rv770 but is in not usable state the dri GL accel yet but the way feels good cuz everything else work pretty well like drm exa/xv accel.
    procedure:
    1.) git a staging kernel to get latest drm (remember to check pciids in the sources files before compile)
    2.) git a mesa r6xx-rewite branch (again check your pciids in radeon folder)
    update3: this is the last post for me for next 2 month(big job came to me) so im going back to nvidia (a gtx260 from an office machine)in the meantime ill keep my 4850x2 so i can read the amd docs and try to help ppl in 3d support after this job.
    Last edited by jrch2k8; 06-21-2009 at 09:52 PM.

  2. #2
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    Another user mentioned that their 2600 X2 card's ID was missing from the PCI ID list in fglrx; I'm wondering if your ID might be missing from part of the driver and causing your performance problems with fglrx. "Crappy" and "slow" could mean anything but "choppy" usually implies that the kernel module didn't start up for some reason and you're running without acceleration.

    If your IDs are missing from radeon it wouldn't surprise me if they were also missing from fglrx, since we tend to get ID info from the same source.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bridgman View Post
    Another user mentioned that their 2600 X2 card's ID was missing from the PCI ID list in fglrx; I'm wondering if your ID might be missing from part of the driver and causing your performance problems with fglrx. "Crappy" and "slow" could mean anything but "choppy" usually implies that the kernel module didn't start up for some reason and you're running without acceleration.

    If your IDs are missing from radeon it wouldn't surprise me if they were also missing from fglrx, since we tend to get ID info from the same source.
    mmm i thougth about that too but glxinfo says AMD GL loaded not software rendered and module load without issues but my problem is that my old 8800 gts 320 kick in the balls my 4850x2 in everything + fglrx broke everything starting from wine to savage2. + heavily grphic corrption + hangup maybe in fglrx is not a pciid isuues but a cf issues cuz if you dont enabled it the system just hang + my friend tried a 4870x2 same issues and the 4890 of his brother falls badly too but they RMA for 295gtx and 280 respectively i took the git path

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    Did you report the missing ids to the ppl in #radeon?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kano View Post
    Did you report the missing ids to the ppl in #radeon?
    mmm not yet but if you can the id is 0x9443

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    BTW have you tried with the 9.6 driver ? There was a fix which addressed a lot of SM3 DX games under Wine. There is also a related Wine fix but not sure if it is available yet on a Wine version that otherwise works well with 9.6. There were a couple of recent posts here with recommended Wine versions.

    Note that enabling Crossfire in the open source drivers is not just a question of enabling some hardware options which we haven't documented. All modern multi-GPU support is implemented in the driver stack, not in the hardware, and there is a lot of other work which needs to be done in the open source drivers before starting on Crossfire is even worth thinking about.

    There is one hardware feature on high-end boards which can speed up multi-GPU performance -- the inter-card link which avoids having to blit framebuffer data across the PCIE buses - but it is not needed to implement Crossfire and I imagine we will have released docs or code for that before the driver framework is ready to use it.

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    actually 9.6 is nicer cuz 9.4 9.5 make wine games to fails but it load so it seems that AMD figure that so they finish the job, cuz with 9.6 now any wine app sisgev instantly

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    Quote Originally Posted by jrch2k8 View Post
    actually 9.6 is nicer cuz 9.4 9.5 make wine games to fails but it load so it seems that AMD figure that so they finish the job, cuz with 9.6 now any wine app sisgev instantly
    bridgman (im junior in IRC) i went back to fglrx before i get monday a gtx260 for a big work next 2 months, ill keep this 4850x2. some thougths about fglrx

    1.) with karmic latest update + wine 1.24 + gentoo patches i got linege2 working but there are some problems.
    * works only with all shaders disabled (any sort of shader generate a really massive screen corruption not happening in nvidia is confirmed with my 8800gts in fact got a nice speed up)
    * crossfire enabled generate severe slow downs + break even more the shaders
    * almost any linux native games generate screen corruption with shaders enabled
    * opengl implementation is considerable slower than my old nvidia 8800 gts
    it seems a rv770 chipset problem cuz phoronix get them to run in single cards maybe 4870x2 have the same issues

    note: fglrx.ko loaded fine + glxinfo show everyhing is rigth + my pciid is in the source file 0x9443

    2.) 2d rendering maybe a sync issues
    * 2d is fast actually not like exa r7xx but yes it render quite fast, but there are weird frame drops in 2d animation like kde cursor animation and 2d in general, it feels like fglrx have X sync function or something or some rv770 issue in 2d area
    * xinerama in ati config break it all so i cannot have 2 monitor plugged cuz i get the same overlaped desktop rendered in the same screen at different resolutions.

    3.) maybe you can propose these instead of keeping so many base codes
    * break the driver per sector aka radeon/firegl, i mean keep r7xx OS without 3rd party + some GL speed love and CF(i mean your balancing idea) + multihead for radeon users and make fglrx fireGL workstaion only.why? enthusiast dont care about drm or overlays or any weird useless software vendor locks in worstation areas, we care about performance (i mean FPS)+ goddies like opencl uvd2 etc and a basic catalystOS without any other 3rd pt and that library for gpuinfo maybe, i payed 330$ for a card for this stuff and i dont wanna be mean but i dont care where driver come from, like most ppl and if i can get it inside my dist out of the box and OS so i can get nice stuff faster, hey ill be just happy.

    4.) BluRay
    i dont need AMD to play it, i cant even care less about hdcp too, i just need udv2 from AMD only that, about the rest xine/mplayer/vlc/etc will take care of reading the file format and the codec + videolan.org can get the crack in no time in fact is just port it to libx264 so is easy

    5.) if you can tell AMD for this tought
    the one thing that make me go to AMD instead of the classic nvidia + intel was AMD move to OS not the money. i changed because i was very mad with both of them, on the intel side cuz of the freak way to design the chips so every new chip is expensier + new mobo(cuz of bios cpuid blocks to force to buy all again) and nvidia with the driver issues (kde4 render bugs last like 2 years or something).

    so my point is AMD got nice hardware god know they do but AMD is not in a market share to be this close minded in fact i readed this company is loosing money like crazy from some time now and please lets be sincere here rigth now AMD have nothing at all that nVidia dont have already in their cards even the performance is about the same in technologys like PureVideo vs UVD2,etc in fact even the quality is about the same. but nVidia is crushing AMD for one reason only "SUPPORT"beside branch name ofc. (this is not about you guyz (dev ppl) in fact bridgman is such a nice helpful guy) nVidia understood that ppl like to use a variety of tools and even operating systems, even just because some friend says, "hey dude, have you tried linux" or "men solaris is kinda cool, you know" and ppl with nvidia card know they can try this options blind folded cuz they make very stable almost windows lvl driver for all this OSes (nVidia OpenCL dev preview driver for unix oses is quite a nice/stable implementation already). So i dont think this is a dev problem is more a marketing + lawyer problem, they need to understand priorities because they arent selling shoes (i own a company too and is incredible how closed minded this ppl can be, they see verything like selling cake or shoes). if you AMD company have to make Dragon plataform a success you need to make the software implementation as good as the hardware is, because you have to understand that current software support on anything beside Windows drivers(well windows have some nasty probs too but overall it works) only generate RMA / mad ppl and stuff like "Ohh, AMD cards look nice" "dude, get nvidia someone tell me this card are unusable and no goddies on some systems". Dragon needs the best driver support and the most goddies possible in any major OS to be a real success and lets face it the current dev team cant handle the task fast enough like nvidia (i dont mean any of you are bad dev or something i just think is a company weak policy) for some of this policies, so you need to get to understand that only the OSource community can handle this task that fast and the support will improve in a nasty way. so AMD consider seriously the next statements.

    1.) Provide full opensource driver support (2D render, 3D render (OpenGL 3.1 compliant), UVD2 API(no need for 3rd party code only video Accel is good enough) Gallium OpenCL, GPU Monitoring+Control Center API (we handle the native implementation of the contro center itself aka GTK/KDE4 etc) because a crippled fast and stable OS driver or a Alpha state FGLRX unstable but with some more feature driver is not going to do any good

    2.) Remember Linux / BSD / OpenSolaris dont need 3rd pt code like HDCP or and ultra specific SGI extension,etc only OpenCompliant feature is enough, so think providing those in a fglrx fireGL only anyway Radeon series dont handle most of Workstation features and lets face it is easier to mantain that way cuz profesional ppl will mostly use Enterprise Linux system so you have a more stable core to develop all the DRM stuff for fireGL and normal ppl can go with whatever they like and it will work (see the easy of use and support for intel gfx card)

    3.) Consider help the communitys to get the best of best of those AMD cards goodies like for example:
    * help transcode / ffmpeg / xvid project to get the hardware accelerated transcoding working like never
    * help xine / mplayer / vlc to get the best perf / quality ratio posible in the hardware video acceleration system
    and then use it as advertising later like "Convert you videos in notime with AMD transparently in any platafrom unlike our competence" and stuff like that.

    4.) Dont get me wrong i appreciate the OSource move done so far but i think this points are necesary to get you back to compete i really will hate a world with only 1 CPU maker and 1 GPU maker cuz that day technology will stall for 10 year or more again. "We need you back in the GAME"

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