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Thread: Another GTK+ 3.0 Pre-Release Arrives

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  1. #1
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    Default Another GTK+ 3.0 Pre-Release Arrives

    Phoronix: Another GTK+ 3.0 Pre-Release Arrives

    Just about one month ago there was the first GTK+ 3.0 test release and then before May ended out there was another development release and it delivered on X Input 2.0 support for GTK. Just days later, another new GTK+ 3.0 test release has been tagged...

    http://www.phoronix.com/vr.php?view=ODMyOQ

  2. #2
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    GTK needs to improve dramatically to catch up to the innovations of the toolkits in Windows and OSX.

    This is highlighted with the simple "Hello World" test where you count the number of lines of code to create a simple Hello World. In GTK it is more than 10 lines or so and in other toolkits it is usually under 4 - 5 lines of code.

    They also are abysmal in keeping bugs in check, I get noticeable bugs in GTK on Ubuntu 10.04 "Lucid Lynx". This is just unacceptable that a toolkit has bugs noticeable to the user.

    I suggest the developers need to go back to the drawing board with GTK and do a complete rewrite to make it faster and more efficient. 2D performance is also poor with GTK so they need to address that as well.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by bugmenot2 View Post
    I suggest the developers need to go back to the drawing board with GTK and do a complete rewrite to make it faster and more efficient. 2D performance is also poor with GTK so they need to address that as well.
    ... or just use Qt4 that doesn't need to catch up

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by val-gaav View Post
    ... or just use Qt4 that doesn't need to catch up
    And up with ugly ugly ugly and incompatible with all required software? No thanks.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by droidhacker View Post
    And up with ugly ugly ugly and incompatible with all required software? No thanks.
    The point was made for a total re write of GTK+ toolkit... If it would get this the new version would be_incompatible_with_all_the_software anyway. Apps would have to be ported...

    Since it is like that why not port to Qt4 a toolkit that is there and is way modern/has more features then GTK+ ?

    Ugliness on the other hand is a thing of preference and any toolkit can look right with a good theme...

    This is all about technology beneath the hood ... and Linux would certainly benefit if it had one toolkit instead of two incompatible ones...

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by val-gaav View Post
    The point was made for a total re write of GTK+ toolkit... If it would get this the new version would be_incompatible_with_all_the_software anyway. Apps would have to be ported...

    Since it is like that why not port to Qt4 a toolkit that is there and is way modern/has more features then GTK+ ?

    Ugliness on the other hand is a thing of preference and any toolkit can look right with a good theme...

    This is all about technology beneath the hood ... and Linux would certainly benefit if it had one toolkit instead of two incompatible ones...
    Sorry but that is a myth. None said there would be a _total_ rewrite. Yeah binary compatibility and API will be broken at _some_ areas yet not at all. That would make no sense.
    The idea of such changes is to remove old cruft, add new stuff where it was not possible before. As well to rearange stuff if it turned out to be far from ideal.

    Same was true for KDE 4.0.

    Yeah I'd like it if Gnome was written in Qt, yet that is just an illusion that won't come true. It would just take too much work for gains that would not justify that. Plain simple: Gnome works pretty well with GTK+ already so rather improve GTK+ than to start over.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by val-gaav View Post
    The point was made for a total re write of GTK+ toolkit... If it would get this the new version would be_incompatible_with_all_the_software anyway. Apps would have to be ported...

    Since it is like that why not port to Qt4 a toolkit that is there and is way modern/has more features then GTK+ ?
    Apps *don't* need to be ported to Gtk+ 3.x, as long as they're already coded to "best practices" for Gtk+ 2.x - i.e not using any of the deprecated API that's being removed, not accessing 'private' data directly, etc. As far as I can tell, well-written code should be compilable against either version.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by bugmenot2 View Post
    GTK needs to improve dramatically to catch up to the innovations of the toolkits in Windows and OSX.

    This is highlighted with the simple "Hello World" test where you count the number of lines of code to create a simple Hello World. In GTK it is more than 10 lines or so and in other toolkits it is usually under 4 - 5 lines of code.
    I have to agree here. This is the reason I use typewriters whenever possible. They produce a "Hello World" in just one line of code and are thus far superior to all that new-fashioned compjooter stuff.

  9. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by bugmenot2 View Post
    GTK needs to improve dramatically to catch up to the innovations of the toolkits in Windows and OSX.

    This is highlighted with the simple "Hello World" test where you count the number of lines of code to create a simple Hello World. In GTK it is more than 10 lines or so and in other toolkits it is usually under 4 - 5 lines of code.
    Ummm... I think you're wrong about Windows... Have you seen Hello World in Win32? It's not easy!

    And then there's MFC - http://pastebin.com/xmUgiKvr - 94 lines.

    It's a little easier in the crippled .Net languages, but only because the visual designer creates all of the UI code for you...

    In Gtkmm (the C++ port - I'm not familiar with the C API), on the other hand;
    Code:
    #include <gtkmm.h>
    
    int main(int argc, char * argv[])
    {
        Gtk::Main kit(argc, argv);
    
        Gtk::Window win;
        Gtk::Label hello("Hello World!");
    
        win.add(hello);
    
        win.show_all();
    
        Gtk::Main::Run(win);
    
        return 0;
    }
    Not hard... In my opinion it's actually better to develop for Windows with Gtkmm than the Windows APIs themselves...

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by srg_13 View Post
    Ummm... I think you're wrong about Windows... Have you seen Hello World in Win32? It's not easy!

    And then there's MFC - http://pastebin.com/xmUgiKvr - 94 lines.

    It's a little easier in the crippled .Net languages, but only because the visual designer creates all of the UI code for you...

    In Gtkmm (the C++ port - I'm not familiar with the C API), on the other hand;
    Code:
    #include <gtkmm.h>
    
    int main(int argc, char * argv[])
    {
        Gtk::Main kit(argc, argv);
    
        Gtk::Window win;
        Gtk::Label hello("Hello World!");
    
        win.add(hello);
    
        win.show_all();
    
        Gtk::Main::Run(win);
    
        return 0;
    }
    Not hard... In my opinion it's actually better to develop for Windows with Gtkmm than the Windows APIs themselves...
    You'll probably want to use Builder, that's even easier (in Vala for bonus points):
    Code:
    using Gtk;
    
    int main(string[] args) {     
        Gtk.init(ref args);
    
        try {
            var builder = new Builder();
            builder.add_from_file("hello.ui");
            builder.connect_signals(null);
            Gtk.main();
        } catch(Error e) { return 1; } 
    
        return 0;
    }

    Compile with: valac --pkg gtk+-2.0 hello.vala

    Now you can design your GUI in the Glade editor.

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