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Thread: Wine 1.2 Officially Released With 23,000+ Changes

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shining Arcanine View Post
    By the way, does anyone have a changelog for the changes since rc7?
    take a look here: http://source.winehq.org/git/wine.git/?

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shining Arcanine View Post
    41 blocker bugs had not been fixed, yet they released wine 1.2 anyway.
    Well it's not like wine is going to release bug free. If they felt like it, they could remove those bugs from the 1.2 blocker list, but would it really change anything? It's all relatively arbitrary decisions as to which bugs are on a blocker list anyway, and there are plenty of other bugs that some people might feel are worth being blockers.

    Anyway, none of that changes the fact that the final RC and the final release shouldn't have many changes.

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shining Arcanine View Post
    41 blocker bugs had not been fixed, yet they released wine 1.2 anyway.
    Comments like these reveal a fundamental misunderstanding of the way software projects are developed.

    It is literally impossible to work through these final bugs that always pop up in different projects in any reasonable amount of time. If they dropped everything for a year, then sure, it could be done. But then they'd just be a year behind when development started up again, and no one would be happy with that. Not to mention that in an OSS project like Wine other developers would simply fork it to continue work rather than waiting for bugs to be fixed.

    Every large project has similar lists when they are released. You never see the ones proprietary software have, and some open source projects make it a point to simply clear the blockers list by reassigning the bugs to a future milestone, but that's no different than what Wine has just done.

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by smitty3268 View Post
    Comments like these reveal a fundamental misunderstanding of the way software projects are developed.
    you saved me a comment

  5. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by tmpdir View Post
    you saved me a comment
    actally not, since you did comment.


    @Shining Arcanine: Have you ever seen the bug lists of the big processor vendors? have you also seen how many bugs are marked as "wont fix" ... in Hardware!!! (and not all are trivial)

    So bugs are normal some take 10 Jears to fix some 2 days and some will never be fixed.

  6. #16
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    as long as there are known workarounds i dont mind a few bugs
    and i especially dont mind not releasing wine 1.2 even later to fix more blocker-bugs
    not because of 1.2 but because now there will be 1.3.XX with ne features again ^^

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by smitty3268 View Post
    Comments like these reveal a fundamental misunderstanding of the way software projects are developed.
    And comments like these reveal a fundamental misunderstanding of the way software projects are _delivered_.

    Why would a user need to care about how the thing gets done? Development strategy is none of user's business, which I'm sure the developers are eager enough to remind us every now and then...

    User only cares about the timing between when he submitted a wish and when it was delivered. About the predictability of such timing and about not having to repeat the same wish twice (or more times).

    Quote Originally Posted by smitty3268 View Post
    It is literally impossible to work through these final bugs that always pop up in different projects in any reasonable amount of time. If they dropped everything for a year, then sure, it could be done. But then they'd just be a year behind when development started up again, and no one would be happy with that. Not to mention that in an OSS project like Wine other developers would simply fork it to continue work rather than waiting for bugs to be fixed.

    Every large project has similar lists when they are released. You never see the ones proprietary software have, and some open source projects make it a point to simply clear the blockers list by reassigning the bugs to a future milestone, but that's no different than what Wine has just done.
    Fair enough, but that's also why I see no logic in the current way Wine gets released. What's the point of 2 (or so) years of 1.1.x versions between supposedly stable 1.0 and 1.2?

    As you correctly mention, a year (or even a half) after 1.0 was out, it was so much behind that noone used it anymore. The typical response to bugs in 1.0 was "try latest 1.1.x", yet to bugs in latest 1.1.x the response was "it's a development version so don't expect stability".

    The same is going to happen to 1.2 versus 1.3. Especially so because the 1.4 release has no deadline, and possibly no goals, making it impossible to make any sort of feedback into the development process.

  8. #18
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    I don't see any open blocker bugs in Wine's Bugzilla. I think people might be confusing "targeted for release" with "blocker".

  9. #19
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    One important thing to note is that WINE is not a standard project, they are trying to implement windows APIs which some of them are not documented , or vaguely / incorrect documented.

    Even on some rare cases Windows APIs have little “bugs / misbehaviors” and windows applications are expecting this “bugs / misbehaviors” in order to work correctly. So WINE devs have to implement them ignoring what windows documentation is saying.

    It's normal that WINE have thousand of bugs, and some of them are unresolved for years. On this wine1.2RC rush they fixed around 40 of the 80 most important bugs, most of them being old bugs affecting a bunch of applications. So I can only see it as a vast and nice improvement.

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