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Thread: For Those Interested In Direct3D Over Gallium3D

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Melcar View Post
    Those developers will focus on D3D. What will be the "thing" that will keep them on Linux? And don't say price, because Windows is basically free as well. Will Linux simply be a copy and cheap imitation of Windows?
    Design and implemenation are totaly different. Linux is for starters a Unix like OS. It is the epic center of the free software ecosystem. It empowers people with how they want their OS to work. If someone comes around the corner with something cool then you can test it out, hack away at it, or live with what other people that hack away at it give you.

    With Windows you have to wait very long for a new itteration compared to Linux. If you want to upgrade for free then you must get a software pirated download, buy a new computer (far from free) or buy Windows, which is kinda like a fucking 300 dollars for a full version.

    What will keep them there is exactly that; love for computers and software. It's fascinating and a hobby. Windows doesn't have that charm, by far. "Don't like this particular feature? Live with it fsck off."

    It's by far not what you probably think it is about.

    Oh and don't get me started about the Windows workflow; it's a disaster...

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Melcar View Post
    Those developers will focus on D3D. What will be the "thing" that will keep them on Linux? And don't say price, because Windows is basically free as well. Will Linux simply be a copy and cheap imitation of Windows?
    Those developers will focus on creating apps for linux. D3D is just a familiar tool for them. What will keep them on linux depends on what they're developing.

  3. #33
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    I think that we need to bring Lindows back, for all the people who want this.

    It should use Mono as default, come with Moonlight, Direct3d and the latest Wine, and be configured to work like Windows and use NTFS as the native filesystem. IE + Wine the default browser.

    Then they can enjoy the unprecendented invasion of developers who bring unimaginable volumes of new code and new apps, and the rest of us can be left alone.

    The fact is that, even if this Direct3D interface ever works, nobody will ship with it -- not RedHat, not Ubuntu, not Mandriva, and certainly not Debian or Gentoo. Maybe Novell will, they have this strange patent agreement with Microsoft, but other distros will not risk a patent lawsuit.

    Even Tungsten (the developers behind Gallium3d) didn't want to touch Direct3D on Linux with a 10-foot pole.

  4. #34
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    Sorry for my bad english in the last comment.

    Hmm I am not 100% shure if we should damn this, if there are some not blackboxed processes in it, we better stay away from it. (distros)
    That has to be checked.

    But it shows the power of Gallium3d. If there was a news that Wine would have better dx1x support, there would be no big deal most people would not be very interessted because Mesa is very nvidia optimised and often very behind the current games (oblivion support did take forever), but because itīs a gallium3d tracker this is totaly interesting, 1. it works especialy good with opensource drivers and second also with the proprietery ones. So even if it really should fail because of patent issues, I hope that more people especialy driver programmers see the advantages of this framework.

    If someone would create a state tracker that would accellerate hd videos over gpu as such a state tracker (if possible) that would be huge and there is more stuff that would be great as state tracker.

    Java is mostly "not ideal" because itīs so big and loading it before programm start takes to long, its only a few seconds but thats to much, why waiting if you could write the same programm in another language with less ram-usage and faster start? If it were at least easier to use, but python is easyer to use, then the all-stuff-in-one framework thing about it sucks too, making bindings from optimized librarys are much better. And now with Oracle behind it, its dieing even faster.
    And the same counts against Mono. Why using a patent-dangered thing if there are good languages like python or ruby if thats your thing.

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by cl333r View Post
    I wouldn't be surprised if Luca Barbieri is getting fat checks from Microsoft directly or indirectly because (a) he (or his team) called OpenGL much worse than D2D/D3D while knowing it's no longer true with the advent of OpenGL 3x/4x and (b) being _so_ eager to implement D2D/D3D despite serious concerns which he denies as if he was a qualified lawyer. He behaves a lot like Miguel de Icaza.., not flaming, just using common sense to judge what's going on.
    No. Nonono. He prefers D3D over OpenGL as a developer. Lots of developers do. There's no need for stupid conspiracy theories here.

    You don't have to be a lawyer to show that you're not violating Microsoft copyright. The Wine developers have actually been behaving a lot like Microsoft by spreading FUD about the new D3D state tracker. It's absolutely ridiculous.

  6. #36
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    I'm seeing hordes of one post wonder new accounts here in these topics. To educate them about the past would be tiresome.

    So considder this; If the is business in Windows interoperability, then why does everybody who is in that very business so cautious? Might that not be because Microsoft has been engaging into very dirty practises?

    Or maybe should put it this way: How come that a company with inferior products came to be the dominant player in the OS market?

    Never underestimate the filthy Microsoft company.

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by V!NCENT View Post
    Or maybe should put it this way: How come that a company with inferior products came to be the dominant player in the OS market?

    Never underestimate the filthy Microsoft company.
    Hate to be the one to break the bad news but the world at large isn't calling Win7 inferior. Oh, yeah, tech sites might love this Ubuntu thing but - well, most don't give a damn. They want the seven love.

    Yeah, sacrilege, blah blah. Just trying to give some perspective.

    I don't know if the goal of the D3D state tracker is interop or a first-class alternative to OpenGL but the amount of interest it has generated speaks volumes. The news have spread like fire even on non Linux-related forums.

  8. #38
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    Win95 was not superior, and neither was Win98, and Win 3.11 for Workgroups even less. Yet these are the products that led to their market dominance, although there were far superior systems out there.

    Like OS/2. You know what killed them? Windows compatibility. Like this tracker here.

    And Windows7 is far from being the best OS out there right now, for any market.

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlackStar View Post
    Hate to be the one to break the bad news but the world at large isn't calling Win7 inferior.
    I hate to be the one to break the bad news but Windows 7 isn't what made Microsoft the dominant player in the 90's.

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by pingufunkybeat View Post
    Win95 was not superior, and neither was Win98, and Win 3.11 for Workgroups even less. Yet these are the products that led to their market dominance, although there were far superior systems out there.

    Like OS/2. You know what killed them? Windows compatibility. Like this tracker here.
    You actually have a point here. OS/2 was compatible with winapi so nobody developed for it (everyone used winapi).

    The difference is that we already have a compatibility layer (Wine) and a cross-platform API (OpenGL) so the D3D state tracker won't really change anything.

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