KDE's Plasma To Be Reworked, Use More OpenGL

[monraaf]

Based on the same logic, I am hereby predicting that every single post you write from now to eternity will be filled with nothing but FUD.

Nice one. But in case you haven't noticed this is about KDE not me. You know play the ball not the man

[Yfrwlf]

Based on the same logic, I am hereby predicting that every single post you write from now to eternity will be filled with nothing but FUD.

Come come, it's logical to expect the same thing based on someone's track record. It in no way means it will be that way of course, so you are really both right.

All I know about KDE is it has failed for me by being too cluttered with stuff I don't want and not enough stuff I do want. Those pieces that I do want that Gnome doesn't have make me jealous, but I would honestly have to play around with it again to remember what I was I was jealous about because I haven't really needed whatever it was I thought I was missing. I've always managed to find some program to give me what I want.

Of course, once you learn some things that you end up loving you ask yourself, "How could I have ever lived without this?!?!" So I'm either mostly satisfied with Gnome, or I just don't know what I'm missing.

Sometime I'll get around to giving 4.5 a go though to see if anything magical happens to my opinion of the, for me at least, confusing choices they have made for their DE. Like the "lets reduce the size of the desktop where you can put files and folders down to a small window, and make it so you can't put them anywhere else on the desktop" choice for instance. Seriously, what the hell. All you've done is turned it from a big background file manager into a small background file manager. Yay.

[smitty3268]

Come come, it's logical to expect the same thing based on someone's track record. It in no way means it will be that way of course, so you are really both right.

My point was that moonraf was cherry-picking only a few examples that stood out in his mind. KDE devs make hundreds of changes all the time, and no one ever complains about them. It's just 1 or 2 high profile ones that do cause problems, and then people start throwing wild accusations around like "every single change they ever make will screw stuff up".

That's nonsense.

[ChrisXY]

I have only two feature requests:

1) Make ist stable.
At my university in the pool there is now Archlinux installed. Therefore I tried KDE again. I was able to use it exactly three seconds until the whole Desktop froze completely. I went to the console and killed plasma and changed back to the desktop. There was a window "Starting Akonadi Server" sitting there for some minutes (!) and then the screen was simplay black...

2) Make it a LITTLE BIT more performant. I have 1 gb Ram at the moment. That ought to be enaugh for your Desktop, shouldn't it?
In fact it is enaugh for KDE. But just try to use some programs and it will fuck your Ram up. When I had 1 gb Ram and 512 mb swap (!) used I seriously had enaugh.

Yes, this is anecdotic, but every time I try KDE I run into the same trouble of it being extremely laggy (context menus taking up to two seconds to open, clicking on buttons just feels slow), buggy rendering (the background picture partly overlays konsole windows or xchat WTF), ressource-intensive and somehow plasma keeps on segfaulting.
Yes, Amarok... I tried amarok2 and it was kind of pretty, but it never played more than one song for me, there was just no sound after the first finished. I guess, phonon kind of sucks with gstreamer... But then put a message in there "Warning, don't use phonon with gstreamer, if possible". I wonder if amarok2 still keeps segfaulting on closing. Maybe I should try it again.

[kraftman]

I have only two feature requests:

1) Make ist stable.
At my university in the pool there is now Archlinux installed. Therefore I tried KDE again. I was able to use it exactly three seconds until the whole Desktop froze completely. I went to the console and killed plasma and changed back to the desktop. There was a window "Starting Akonadi Server" sitting there for some minutes (!) and then the screen was simplay black...

You've got no luck or there's something seriously messed up. What graphic drivers are there?

2) Make it a LITTLE BIT more performant. I have 1 gb Ram at the moment. That ought to be enaugh for your Desktop, shouldn't it?
In fact it is enaugh for KDE. But just try to use some programs and it will fuck your Ram up. When I had 1 gb Ram and 512 mb swap (!) used I seriously had enaugh.

It doesn't usually use more then 600MB on my box on 64bit platform.

Yes, this is anecdotic, but every time I try KDE I run into the same trouble of it being extremely laggy (context menus taking up to two seconds to open, clicking on buttons just feels slow), buggy rendering (the background picture partly overlays konsole windows or xchat WTF), ressource-intensive and somehow plasma keeps on segfaulting.

What drivers?

Yes, Amarok... I tried amarok2 and it was kind of pretty, but it never played more than one song for me, there was just no sound after the first finished. I guess, phonon kind of sucks with gstreamer... But then put a message in there "Warning, don't use phonon with gstreamer, if possible". I wonder if amarok2 still keeps segfaulting on closing. Maybe I should try it again.

Yes, Amarok which I have no single problem with it. It's gstreamer which sucks with Phonon. ;> Using KDE with Phonon you're free to use VLC, XINE and Gstreamer, but gstreamer sucks with it. Nope, Amarok doesn't segfault on exit. You had seriously messed up system I guess, the same as me, but when I was running the latest 'stable' Gnome release on Fedora.

[kraftman]

Almost always both. Both KDE and driver developers should talk to each other and resolve any issues together, especially when KDE people launch a new product the driver devs don't know about or don't test (they are usually more busy with making games work and fast).

I've got the same feeling. On the other side it seems they have better communication with Gnome people, but maybe just Gnome devs made the first step or it's due to some Red Hat priorities. While Gallium is starting kicking ass and radeon drivers are maturing KWin devs should take a look more closely on open source graphic stack and thus make KDE run flawlessly out of the box on open source drivers. I hope this will happen.

[pingufunkybeat]

Sometime I'll get around to giving 4.5 a go though to see if anything magical happens to my opinion of the, for me at least, confusing choices they have made for their DE.

I don't think that there's anything magical. It's just very smooth and feels very modern, and does everything I need it to.

Like the "lets reduce the size of the desktop where you can put files and folders down to a small window, and make it so you can't put them anywhere else on the desktop" choice for instance. Seriously, what the hell. All you've done is turned it from a big background file manager into a small background file manager. Yay.

You know that you can toggle this with a single click, right?

The reason is moving away from the Windows-mode of having the desktop as a large warehouse of temporary files towards a more traditional Unix or NeXT desktop.

MacOSX went in the other direction, really, seeing as how it was developed on NeXT principles after Apple bought them.

[kraftman]

@ChrisXY

Provide your bug reports, please. It will be great opportunity to check what, so strange was happening on mentioned systems, because you're not just putting random crap, are you?

[pingufunkybeat]

I've got the same feeling. On the other side it seems they have better communication with Gnome people, but maybe just Gnome devs made the first step or it's due to some Red Hat priorities. While Gallium is starting kicking ass and radeon drivers are maturing KWin devs should take a look more closely on open source graphic stack and thus make KDE run flawlessly out of the box on open source drivers. I hope this will happen.

I agree that the KDE guys blundered with the KWin 4.5.

At the same time, don't forget that RedHat employees do a lot of the open driver work, and they also employ many of the GNOME hackers. They don't employ any KDE people. Of course the communication is better with the former.

[kraftman]

You know that you can toggle this with a single click, right?

If someone has problems with such trivial thing then he should stay as far from Gnome 3 as possible.