Another Look At The Latest Nouveau Gallium3D Driver

[blackiwid]

I dont use that software, I did not even know that there is a linux version of maya

I am using that card at my home-pc there I maybe develop some stuff or even make a 3d game (canta-game.org) that works with that driver so there is no problem. If you need more speed for working buy a nvidia card. For proffessional stuff its legitim to make compromisses in my opinion, because if you hunger to death you dont have very much of your more on freedom.

[deanjo]

For proffessional stuff its legitim to make compromisses in my opinion, because if you hunger to death you dont have very much of your more on freedom.

The freedom of being able to run all my apps efficiently NOW > the freedom of 5 years down the road and still operating @ 1/2 speed. I rarely use cards on a daily basis that are over 2 years old. Still some of the cards I have are a decade old and still working fine with blobs. That support cycle is long enough to over come any FOSS FUD propaganda.

[blackiwid]

The freedom of being able to run all my apps efficiently NOW > the freedom of 5 years down the road and still operating @ 1/2 speed. I rarely use cards on a daily basis that are over 2 years old. Still some of the cards I have are a decade old and still working fine with blobs. That support cycle is long enough to over come any FOSS FUD propaganda.

So we have a different view-point of freedom, k no problem, no point in fighting over it, when you just want a good driver and don´t care about opnesource/freesoftware go ahead use windows or buy a nvidia card and you will be happy. I want to have control over my life, if I as example are starting a company and maybe am successful, maybe I could pay 1 or 2 persons to make the driver better or include one thing that I wish, ok in grafics-drivers that seems to be always big work, but the point is the same. And -> I <- don´t trust companys at all because their goal is to sell stuff to us, so if they are done with that, they have no point to give support after that. Also nvidia could be bought by some other company lets say oracle or sony or whatever, this company could than say we want to spare money and we dont or less often release new drivers for linux because we think thats not worth it. They could even say we don´t release a newer driver at all.

Companys don´t have interest to do good stuff, they kill kittens or fish the sea empty if that gives them money. I want the control over the stuff I buy. Even if thats in a theoretical way because I am not a kernel-driver-developer. But I know there exist people that have the same goals that I have and if AMD shuts down their opensource strategy, the driver will become better without them. At least for the cards that are out now.

If you are trust in nvidia go ahead be happy with them. I have no problem with that.

[BlackStar]

The freedom of being able to run all my apps efficiently NOW > the freedom of 5 years down the road and still operating @ 1/2 speed. I rarely use cards on a daily basis that are over 2 years old. Still some of the cards I have are a decade old and still working fine with blobs. That support cycle is long enough to over come any FOSS FUD propaganda.

You know, this very argument is also valid when comparing Windows with Linux. Just sayin'.

[BlackStar]

Have you ever tried using Maya, Pro/E, or any GPGPU with free drivers? I won't even go into video decoding.

In short, if you wish to purchase a card for future support that may if your lucky achieve 50-60% of the speed of a blob, sacrifice features, decreased efficiency, 3-5 years after your initial purchase then all the more power to you. Not everybody has that money to waste.

The free drivers are meant for home users. Home users don't use applications that cost $xxxxx, with strict hardware and software certification requirements.

That should be rather obvious.

[deanjo]

You know, this very argument is also valid when comparing Windows with Linux. Just sayin'.

Absolutely true. That's why FUD is no way to base any decision but to use the facts that are readily available at the time. Right now that fact is that the blobs give the best performance and features.

The free drivers are meant for home users.

And yet things like video playback is ignored. Now as a home user don't you think that is kind of a big one to let slide? Last time I checked almost all HTPC's were located home users domiciles.

Home users don't use applications that cost $xxxxx, with strict hardware and software certification requirements.

Not all do that is for sure but some do. BTW the certification requirements for those apps are for support purposes. They run fine on blobs even with consumer class hardware.

[blackiwid]

The free drivers are meant for home users. Home users don't use applications that cost $xxxxx, with strict hardware and software certification requirements.

That should be rather obvious.

I don´t agree with you here, the free driver should in mid-long time replace the proprietary drivers. So like in cheap linux routers they provide then much proffesional features that not everybody needs. But thats not neccecary the work that amd have to do but they have to provide the documents that people need to make a driver with no restriction, also if amd give no uvd details, there are other ways to accellerate video other gpu, that goal has to be possible. Because else in long run the driver not even is good enough for home-users. I fancied to arm/chips because they seem to provide long batterie livetime and video-acceleration, but 3d and this video-acceleration is not in a free driver. So Arm is dead for me now. Because in 2-3 years or even faster? I will can play videos with 1080p in linux (without a 8core cpu) with high enough fps. Or then someday maybe 2560p or something like that.
That had to be reachable else I revert my viewpoint and wait till someone provides me with that possibillity in a free driver. Dont get me wrong I do not demand it today to have it now, but I want in someday in the future, because else that specs or driver would not be free, its then not more or less free than the nv-driver because you only get a part that allows you to do x y but not z.

[BlackStar]

Absolutely true. That's why FUD is no way to base any decision but to use the facts that are readily available at the time. Right now that fact is that the blobs give the best performance and features.

With this mindset, Windows offers even better performance and features - so why not use that?

(Yes, it really does: better video acceleration, faster 2d, faster 3d (compare Unigine DX11 vs OGL), more games, more applications. Why use Linux?)

And yet things like video playback is ignored. Now as a home user don't you think that is kind of a big one to let slide? Last time I checked almost all HTPC's were located home users domiciles.

Ignored is too strong a word. Getting correct 2d and 3d acceleration is more important than video (that is being worked on, btw).

BTW the certification requirements for those apps are for support purposes. They run fine on blobs even with consumer class hardware.

They may but noone is buying a $10000 application to run it on an unsupported OS and uncertified hardware.

[BlackStar]

I don´t agree with you here, the free driver should in mid-long time replace the proprietary drivers.

That's logistically impossible. The three major vendors have something like 300 people working on their closed-source drivers. The open-source drivers are developed by maybe 30-odd people, several of whom unpaid.

It might sound harsh but the open drivers will never catch up to the blobs as things stand. Which is fine, since what they need to do is become good enough for the average user.

[deanjo]

[QUOTE=BlackStar;169048]With this mindset, Windows offers even better performance and features - so why not use that?

(Yes, it really does: better video acceleration, faster 2d, faster 3d (compare Unigine DX11 vs OGL), more games, more applications. Why use Linux?)

Better video acceleration, nope, vdpau works fine. Faster 2D, feels identical here. faster 3d, nope, (I did actually compare Unigine, sorry to disappoint you. http://phoronix.com/forums/showthrea...196#post157196), more games, not something I actively do, more applications, sure there is but only a couple that require me to actually run windows.

Why use linux, for me it is the development tools, the ability to customize and strip down, the performance is on par, it is free as in beer, and does almost everything that I want to do when combined with closed proprietary apps. In other words 'it works' for my tasks.

Ignored is too strong a word. Getting correct 2d and 3d acceleration is more important than video (that is being worked on, btw).

I wouldn't say ignored is to strong of a word. They choose to work on other items. As far as video support being "worked on" that is an extreme stretch of the phrase.

They may but noone is buying a $10000 application to run it on an unsupported OS and uncertified hardware.

You would be surprised. I know of 4 engineering outfits just off hand for example that have purchased Pro/E and are running them on consumer class cards. It works out fine for them.