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Thread: GNOME 3.0 Laptop Change Frustrates Some Users

  1. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by blackiwid View Post
    So please can you enligethen me, does kde give you the choice or freedom to not have cancel buttons or do you just want cancel buttons not the freedon of choice that you claim?
    Here's the light: if for some reason you don't like cancel buttons, just don't use them. There lies freedom.

    Here's more light: pop up the properties of a file called "threadedstorage01-20110301_v35-en_UK.deb" . Then accidentally hit the keyboard with your palm. Outcome:

    KDE - you press the "cancel" button and you're set.
    GNOME - watch the file becoming called "hjkyu" beyond repair. Then contemplate the zen essence of the lifeless gray area of the dialog where the "cancel" button would be.

  2. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iksf View Post
    Cant get more than 30 fps on sauer on KDE for some reason, games performance on KDE was the main reason i couldnt use it. Gnome with or without a load of compiz owned it
    Unlike GNOME Shell or Unity, KDE’s Plasma Desktop is not tied to any specific window manager.
    If your driver-Xorg combination causes KWin to decrease overall performance, you can just as well use Compiz or any other window manager.

  3. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ulukai View Post
    For me personally it won't bother me too much since I'm firing up gconf-settings every time right-away after a fresh installation to change some visual stuff and hide things from the desktop etc, but think about average users.

    Well it would be dconf-editor for Gnome 3.

    As far as everybody else goes... your all nuts. Closing the lid to suspend is the way it should be and it's impossible to get right otherwise without confusing the average end user. Whether or not there is a check mark to enable or disable the feature is immaterial... there remains a lot of heuristics left to make sure that the system behaves correctly when the laptop lid is closed and it's not something that anybody has gotten correct so far.

    Without the option working correctly and being fully supported then there is no point to having that option. It just confuses the issue.

    99% of the reason to NOT have your laptop suspend automatically has to do with crappy graphics drivers and the general shittiness of X. So instead of forcing the user to work around shitty drivers in Linux... the drivers need to be fixed.

    That is the whole point of this. Fix the fucking graphics drivers.

    For too long Linux has depended on users screwing around with their systems trying this or that configuration or different software options to work around broken crap like X crashing on suspend. That has to end _NOW_ if Linux has any hope of being a non-Geek desktop OS.

    It has far less to do with making it easy to use for morons and much more to do with not shipping a OS that is broken by default. Nobody wants to put up with this crap anymore.

  4. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by drag View Post
    Well it would be dconf-editor for Gnome 3.

    As far as everybody else goes... your all nuts. Closing the lid to suspend is the way it should be and it's impossible to get right otherwise without confusing the average end user.
    Well I have to disagree, I see plenty of laptops sitting on a desk attached to a keyboard, mouse and monitor with the laptop display closed. A "sensible default (tm of gnome)" is to allow the user to choose how closing the lid is handled like pretty much every other OS out there.

  5. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by deanjo View Post
    Well I have to disagree, I see plenty of laptops sitting on a desk attached to a keyboard, mouse and monitor with the laptop display closed. A "sensible default (tm of gnome)" is to allow the user to choose how closing the lid is handled like pretty much every other OS out there.
    That's how I use mine at work. However, if I understood correctly, with an external monitor attached, Gnome3 will just transfer the output and not suspend. But my own laptop... I like that one to hibernate when I close the lid. Of course, I'm on KDE4.

  6. #76

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    Quote Originally Posted by drag View Post
    It has far less to do with making it easy to use for morons and much more to do with not shipping a OS that is broken by default. Nobody wants to put up with this crap anymore.
    Manufacturers not respecting the ACPI spec are also a part of the problem, as long as they only target windows which do not follow ACPI too. On my laptop, after a windows hibernation, you can't reboot on anything else than the windows previously shut down. It does not happen on my desktop because the mainboard manufacturer don't screw with the ACPI.

    Such crappy BIOS (you can read EFI in not too distant future) are too common in the "notebook" market. Remember when you had to dig around making your own DSDT to circumvent the crappy one that was almost for sure compiled with Microsoft tools, not intel ones. Still today, sometimes you can't even use cpu frequency scaling because of such a bad behaviour.

    Back in 2007 I tried to get things a little better, and compile my own DSDT to get things recognized correctly (I simply needed to control the backlight of the screen...). After more than 3 hours of fixing the bad syntax errors I had, I finally got the keys for controlling the backlight working (and some minor things you appreciate when you discover it).

    I don't even know I would have enough patience to do it again, because the manufacturer don't want to follow specs he has theorically worked on when defining it. And I don't even think about telling friends to do it if they want a linux laptop.

    They say "suspend is the default behaviour". OK with that, even Windows do it by default. But even on Windows you have the ability to change it (what I do). Telling they don't let you the basic option to change that... Was Linus full of Spice when he talked about nazism ?

  7. #77

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    Quote Originally Posted by drag View Post
    99% of the reason to NOT have your laptop suspend automatically has to do with crappy graphics drivers and the general shittiness of X. So instead of forcing the user to work around shitty drivers in Linux... the drivers need to be fixed.
    Sorry, but as you have probably noticed there are dozens of users who don't want gnome 3 to behave that shitty way and who want to have a choice (btw. there's always a choice called KDE). Why does gnome devs consider gnome users are freaking idiots?

  8. #78

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    Quote Originally Posted by phoronix View Post
    Phoronix: GNOME 3.0 Laptop Change Frustrates Some Users

    On a GNOME 2.x desktop if you are a laptop owner you can control what happens when you close your laptop's lid from the power management preferences whether to suspend the system or simply blank the screen. With GNOME 3.0, when you close your laptop's lid, the system will suspend and there will be no user-interface for changing this policy. It's a design decision for the GNOME 3.0 desktop...

    http://www.phoronix.com/vr.php?view=OTA3NA
    It sounds like Linus Torvalds and many others are going to switch back to KDE soon, if they haven't already.

  9. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by drag View Post
    Closing the lid to suspend is the way it should be and it's impossible to get right otherwise without confusing the average end user.
    Indeed. If some nerd wants to not suspend his laptop, he sure will be able to edit the blacklist file or use another power manager.
    So far only Mac OS X gets it right: On lid close, suspend to RAM and as backup in case of battery failure also suspend to disk.

    Quote Originally Posted by deanjo View Post
    Well I have to disagree, I see plenty of laptops sitting on a desk attached to a keyboard, mouse and monitor with the laptop display closed. A "sensible default (tm of gnome)" is to allow the user to choose how closing the lid is handled like pretty much every other OS out there.
    Those morons are risking to overheat their laptops. And they are far from the majority.


    Quote Originally Posted by kraftman View Post
    Sorry, but as you have probably noticed there are dozens of users who don't want gnome 3 to behave that shitty way and who want to have a choice (btw. there's always a choice called KDE). Why does gnome devs consider gnome users are freaking idiots?
    GNOME users don't want configuration options. If they wanted them, they wouldn't use GNOME.
    Ever since GNOME 2.0 – which is almost 10 years ago – its users don't want configurability.

    Quote Originally Posted by Shining Arcanine View Post
    It sounds like Linus Torvalds and many others are going to switch back to KDE soon, if they haven't already.
    Only retards care about what Linus uses.

  10. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by Awesomeness View Post
    Those morons are risking to overheat their laptops. And they are far from the majority.
    Lol, believe it or not many laptops are fully capable of cooling that setup and it is expected behavior and by design.

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