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Thread: Germany export 4MWh E-Energy although 8 Nuclear-Power-Stations turned off

  1. #101
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    According to the artcle:
    -8 nuclear plants closed;
    -Germany accounts for 4 billion kWh of surplus energy, just in the first 6 months of 2011;
    -It looks like Germany import a lot of nuclear energy from France and the Czech republic, but that's mainly because Germany is an energy transit country, that's linked to 9 other countries that it supplies energy to.

    Because of a few nuclear accidents in Germany, due to some fscking around, Sweden has requiested Germany for some energy reform. It appears that that's what all this green energy is all about.

  2. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qaridarium View Post
    sure you are late because you are the 3. how come with that.
    sure i fail here. its not 4MWh its 4TWt(h) in 6 month means 8TWt in a year. in your numbers 400 000€ a shitload of money.
    And sure you don't mind keeping failing with simplest math again and again, as I see. You made yet another mistake and you don't even notice that. Like I said before, that's typical for the eco-fundamentalists. And you call yourself "electrician"? I certainly would avoid letting you do any cabling, that would be too damn dangerous.

    But now let's come back to the topic and to the real issue. I know that info about 4TWh that was spread a few days ago. They claim there was an import of 23.9 TWh and export of 27.9 TWh in the first half year, which gives the net export of ~4TWh in this time span. If you didn't know: the first half-year starts on January 1 and ends on June 30. Do you realize the implications of this? No?

    The implication is that the NPPs operated for 40% of that time. Another implication is that the beginning of the first half-year is in winter, where power production is highest, while the end is in summer, where many NPPs go offline for yearly inspection, as the electricity demand is low in summer. The export in the first half year was only possible BECAUSE the NPPs operated for some time to supply nuclear power to Austria, NOT DESPITE they were stopped as you claim.

    Imagine that someone has a job and earns 5000 euros a month. Unfortunately he gets fired imid-March and now has to live on welfare, say 500 eur/m, and can't find another job. So, the balance at the end of the first half-year is 2.5*5000+3.5*500 = 14250, or 2375 Eur/m. Now, it looks like he still earned a neat sum per month despite being fired, didn't he? According to your logic, the job isn't that essential, he could still be spending ~ 2000 euros a month and have neat life.

    the export with 8 nuclear power plants off-line is in real 1000 times higher than my claim why in hell makes this nuclear power plants essential for Germany?
    and you think the green voters are brainless? but in Germany the CDU and FDP quit nuclear power and the CDU and the FDP is not the green party.
    this means in germany all voters are brainless. because we do not have more parties.
    the article i posted do have this tropic and you are wrong. Germany is a transit country this means the nuclear power only transit to other Europe countries .
    Nuclear power is essential for Germany because it has energy-intensive industry. Sure, this can be achieved without nuclear energy, by switching back to coal (this is what is happening now). But - we also have this. another retarded goal set by the greens - to reduce the CO2 emissions. What will happen (in the best case scenario) - the higher emissions will be taxed, electricity costs go through the roof, and our industry will start leaving the country, causing slow economic destruction of German economy. In the worst case scenario, the building of new coal power plants will be blocked, causing us to import electricity, like we currently do now. prices go up even faster, causing the industry to leave even sooner.

    Germany export 4TWh in the first 6 month of this year.
    hey maybe you can'T read the German article but hey you are wrong.
    Germany can shut down another round of 2 nuclear power stations without getting any electric power from the outside.
    [/quote]
    Germany currently imports electricity. It transits some, but the 2-4GW I mentioned already take that into account. These 2-4GW are consumed in Germany, another couple GWs are transited, mostly for Austria.

    These values are based on hard facts. You don't need to believe me, I don#t want anyone to believe me, you should just take the import/export data and calculate it yourself. 15-minutes intervals, sorted by county, all online, just substract import from export and see for yourself how much we are "exporting" - it's all in negative range since March.

  3. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by kaorukun View Post
    And sure you don't mind keeping failing with simplest math again and again, as I see. You made yet another mistake and you don't even notice that. Like I said before, that's typical for the eco-fundamentalists. And you call yourself "electrician"? I certainly would avoid letting you do any cabling, that would be too damn dangerous.
    LOL.. i do not call my self an electrician i only point out that i was 5 years in professional training in information electronics and electricians.

    and you call me a eco-fundamentalist? do you read the theat? i vote for burn more coal without any filter to get more sulfur acid in the air and more aerosols of dirty air because then the plants grow faster
    and i post multible articles about dirty air and faster growing plants and clima cooling effect of sulfur in the air.
    and i also point out that more CO2 is better for us!

    you fail completely!

    Quote Originally Posted by kaorukun View Post
    But now let's come back to the topic and to the real issue. I know that info about 4TWh that was spread a few days ago. They claim there was an import of 23.9 TWh and export of 27.9 TWh in the first half year, which gives the net export of ~4TWh in this time span. If you didn't know: the first half-year starts on January 1 and ends on June 30. Do you realize the implications of this? No?

    The implication is that the NPPs operated for 40% of that time. Another implication is that the beginning of the first half-year is in winter, where power production is highest, while the end is in summer, where many NPPs go offline for yearly inspection, as the electricity demand is low in summer. The export in the first half year was only possible BECAUSE the NPPs operated for some time to supply nuclear power to Austria, NOT DESPITE they were stopped as you claim.

    Imagine that someone has a job and earns 5000 euros a month. Unfortunately he gets fired imid-March and now has to live on welfare, say 500 eur/m, and can't find another job. So, the balance at the end of the first half-year is 2.5*5000+3.5*500 = 14250, or 2375 Eur/m. Now, it looks like he still earned a neat sum per month despite being fired, didn't he? According to your logic, the job isn't that essential, he could still be spending ~ 2000 euros a month and have neat life.
    sorry i can't find your point here. all statistic show that green energy brings more payed work than all other energy power plants.

    Quote Originally Posted by kaorukun View Post
    Nuclear power is essential for Germany because it has energy-intensive industry.
    LOL you are joking thats why the FDP+CDU quits nuclear power? and a little time before that the the Green+SPD Quits nuclear power?
    the only party with no quiting nuclear power is the "the left party" but only because they do not was in GOV.
    really all germans want to quit nuclear power! ALL!

    germany gives a fuck about so called "energy-intensive-industry" and because why?
    the energy-intensive-industry renewable energy levy cash freed

    now what? you only just don't know anything about german.

    Quote Originally Posted by kaorukun View Post
    Sure, this can be achieved without nuclear energy, by switching back to coal (this is what is happening now). But - we also have this. another retarded goal set by the greens - to reduce the CO2 emissions. What will happen (in the best case scenario) - the higher emissions will be taxed, electricity costs go through the roof, and our industry will start leaving the country, causing slow economic destruction of German economy. In the worst case scenario, the building of new coal power plants will be blocked, causing us to import electricity, like we currently do now. prices go up even faster, causing the industry to leave even sooner.
    the germany gov also want to quit coal now what you just don't know anything about germany?

    the only point about coal is that they use it to build up there 400 000 000 000€ green energy plan.

    after that coal is useless.

  4. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qaridarium View Post
    what are YOUUUUU smoking??? i post sources about burning coal in dirty power plants cools the earth down.

    here the source again! : http://www.zeit.de/wissen/umwelt/201...chwefel-wetter
    Not really, it doesn't cool the Earth, it just slows down GW a bit. But yes, you can achieve cooling effect with coal powerplants - just remove sulfur and particulate scrubbers.

    But then, you'd also get acid rains, cancer, asthma and other niceties. And that's not a conjecture, that's what had been happening before the pollution controls were enacted.

  5. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qaridarium View Post
    sorry i can't find your point here. all statistic show that green energy brings more payed work than all other energy power plants.
    What you don't seem to understand is that creating cheap energy is essential. More paying jobs for creating energy doesn't really mean that. And thats the real problem with almost all green energy. Wind power is getting close to being competitive, just few times more expensive than nuclear power i think. That's because it's been mass produced for a decade.
    Last edited by virta; 10-02-2011 at 12:38 PM.

  6. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by virta View Post
    What you don't seem to understand is that creating cheap energy is essential. More paying jobs for creating energy doesn't really mean that. And thats the real problem with almost all green energy. Wind power is getting close to being competitive, just few times more expensive than nuclear power i think. That's because it's been mass produced for a decade.
    Most cost analysis for nuclear power doesn’t include the amount of money needed for the development and the construction of final disposition. A sum which almost exceeds the amount of money needed to replace all nuclear power plants by wind/wave powered alternatives.

    --------------


    Everything about nuclear power is crazy. It takes years to build it, it takes years to demolish it and all reactors have a limited lifetime before they do break. Worst of all, it only takes a handful of politicians to reduce the safety of a plant and cause a catastrophic event.

    The great thing about green electricity is that you can waste it on anything you like. A more powerful CPU and GPU for example, cooled by thermoelectric cooling of course. The only downside of green electricity is the amount of neodymium needed by the generators.

  7. #107
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    Cost analysis I last read includes link (sorry, in finnish). Cost for final disposition is about twice the price of fuel (uranium). And combined they are about same than build cost for reactor with 40 years life. This sums to about 35€/MWh. Cost for wind energy is twice that. So we are surely reading different analysis.

    You should definitely think of relocating if handful of politicians can do that where you are living.
    Last edited by virta; 10-02-2011 at 01:55 PM.

  8. #108
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    We shouldn't even be discussing wind energy until there's improvements with efficiency. It's useless.

    As a few others here have said, the output and efficiency is well below all other 'renewable' / green energies. Wind gusts aren't enough in most cases and then wind mills aren't even moving and wind turbines are also useless. Wind requires backups in all cases. But, Q refuses to listen.

    Nuclear energy at least, has the best output and energy with least amount of CO2 in comparison. The only downside is safety and consequences in cases of accident plus radiation effects etc. etc. It's not whether to move to another energy but when.

    Countries like Germany are sacrificing their economy with stupidity, trying to have an unreasonably rapid transfer to other energies, bailing out other countries and generally selling out their entire country for other political groups/politicians to profit.

    Why are Germans so stupid?!? They need to wake up and realize that the politicians just put a guilt trip on them each time.

    The other reasons for other energies are not based on efficiency or cost either, it's based on profits to corporations and the politicians in bed with them. Think of terms of contracts and who benefits most. Solar, wind etc. The Government gives generous contracts to foreign contractors to build these factories and they'll manufacture the parts and equipment.... it's big money. Then they gouge the customers and populace with higher energy bills and taxes. Wake up, man!

  9. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by Silverthorn View Post
    Everything about nuclear power is crazy. It takes years to build it, it takes years to demolish it and all reactors have a limited lifetime before they do break. Worst of all, it only takes a handful of politicians to reduce the safety of a plant and cause a catastrophic event.
    The longest stage in nuclear powerplant building is not construction, but regulatory approval. Reactor lifetime is now greatly improved, reactors which are now being built have 50 year lifetime with possibility to extend it. Waste problem is solved by fuel reprocessing. The remaining waste amount is so small that it can be, basically, ignored.

    So all nuclear problems are not just solvable, but have already been solved in practice. Except the main one: public approval.

  10. #110
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cyberax View Post
    Waste problem is solved by fuel reprocessing.
    Tell me about it.

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