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Thread: Germany export 4MWh E-Energy although 8 Nuclear-Power-Stations turned off

  1. #271
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    Default Facts about today's Energy

    I'm Spanish, if Spain is great today for something is as an example of THINGS you SHOULD NOT do.

    Within Europe, I believe Spain is second only to Germany on "green energy". We have so much installed power in wind and solar technologies that some of our solar plants were able to produce even during the night... (well, thanks to some diesel engines, of course... you know the more you produced on solar energy the more money you got from the government, I mean, the tax-payer)

    Frauds apart, Spain has at the same time much less Installed Nuclear Power than any of our neighbours. This alone is one of the reasons why we cannot reach the Germans in green technology, because, as anyone should now, current green technologies produce energy NOT connected to grid demand, but to sun and wind availability, so you need a lot of non green power plants in place to compensate for green energy random generation variations. In other words, your green installation base cannot be greater than x% of your energy sources (being the rest demand driven) and as Germany has more traditional energy plants that Spain, they can afford to put more solar and wind plants that we can.

    Isn't it a pity than to have more Green Energy you need to grow your NON-green installed base?

    Well the fact is that Spain should be the "Ecologist Dreamed Paradise", right?
    Well it isn't!

    Spain depends 80% on Hydrocarbon energy sources (gas, coal, etc)
    It also depends 80% or so from foreign generated energy AND does not own many Hydrocarbon sources, which is a problem on crisis and recession times.

    In the end we buy a lot of Nuclear Power to our neighbours from the north, that is France, nad much more expensive that if we generated it at home. Yes, France, that country with more than 50 power plants and that long history of big nuclear failures... of exactly 0!

    A few years ago, our clueless president decided that one of the few Nuclear Power Plants should be closed soon, even thought the spanish nuclear security agency had a report saying it was safe for some more years still.

    Well you probably think the local people around the plant felt relieved... hell no! they demonstrated plenty against the plant closing! they thought it was good for them to have it there! ("crazy bastards", don't you think?)

    There also was the need to find for a location to hold a nuclear waste treatment plant. What happened with that? well quite a few local town halls asked for it to go to them and it was the bigger region governments that were trying to stop them... you know elections were not too far away and nuclear power has a bad press on most voters.

    Contrary to what you'd expect, the ones complaining are the ones that WILL NOT have the nuclear plant or waste treatment complex near, but the ones that will have it relatively far away. The ones that live with a nuclear power plant nearby don't want it to go away and other even ask for it to come along.

    So now you know!

    Do you want to be GREENER?, just do like they do in Spain!
    But later don't complain you pollution and unemployment rises.
    Spain has many problems, but the expensive, inefficient and TOO-Green Energy sector is NOT the least of them. It is probably one of our top 3 biggest problems.

    Do you really want to imitate us? Think again,

  2. #272
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    Quote Originally Posted by josvazg View Post
    I'm Spanish, if Spain is great today for something is as an example of THINGS you SHOULD NOT do.
    Maybe you are a little confused.

    Quote Originally Posted by josvazg View Post
    Within Europe, I believe Spain is second only to Germany on "green energy".
    Denmark?


    Quote Originally Posted by josvazg View Post
    We have so much installed power in wind and solar technologies that some of our solar plants were able to produce even during the night... (well, thanks to some diesel engines, of course...
    you are confused this is REAL!!!'


    Quote Originally Posted by josvazg View Post
    you know the more you produced on solar energy the more money you got from the government, I mean, the tax-payer)
    in germany there is no Subvention in green energy.

    Quote Originally Posted by josvazg View Post
    Frauds apart, Spain has at the same time much less Installed Nuclear Power than any of our neighbours.
    compare it to Denmark?

    Quote Originally Posted by josvazg View Post
    This alone is one of the reasons why we cannot reach the Germans in green technology, because, as anyone should now, current green technologies produce energy NOT connected to grid demand, but to sun and wind availability, so you need a lot of non green power plants in place to compensate for green energy random generation variations. In other words, your green installation base cannot be greater than x% of your energy sources (being the rest demand driven) and as Germany has more traditional energy plants that Spain, they can afford to put more solar and wind plants that we can.
    Relax and Enjoy the Germans pay for it for the EU!

    Quote Originally Posted by josvazg View Post
    Isn't it a pity than to have more Green Energy you need to grow your NON-green installed base?
    sure in germany they build sun powered combination coal power plants.


    Quote Originally Posted by josvazg View Post
    Well the fact is that Spain should be the "Ecologist Dreamed Paradise", right?
    Well it isn't!
    Paradise is what you make it

    Quote Originally Posted by josvazg View Post
    Spain depends 80% on Hydrocarbon energy sources (gas, coal, etc)
    It also depends 80% or so from foreign generated energy AND does not own many Hydrocarbon sources, which is a problem on crisis and recession times.
    it just needs time until the european smart grits hit the market.


    Quote Originally Posted by josvazg View Post
    In the end we buy a lot of Nuclear Power to our neighbours from the north, that is France, nad much more expensive that if we generated it at home. Yes, France, that country with more than 50 power plants and that long history of big nuclear failures... of exactly 0!
    i know many nuclear failures in France. its just your mind you are not open for facts.


    Quote Originally Posted by josvazg View Post
    A few years ago, our clueless president decided that one of the few Nuclear Power Plants should be closed soon, even thought the spanish nuclear security agency had a report saying it was safe for some more years still.
    security is relatively the security of the atoms? sure they are save!

    Quote Originally Posted by josvazg View Post
    Well you probably think the local people around the plant felt relieved... hell no! they demonstrated plenty against the plant closing! they thought it was good for them to have it there! ("crazy bastards", don't you think?)
    instead of wasting time on nuclear power plants they should eat LSD-




    Quote Originally Posted by josvazg View Post
    There also was the need to find for a location to hold a nuclear waste treatment plant. What happened with that? well quite a few local town halls asked for it to go to them and it was the bigger region governments that were trying to stop them... you know elections were not too far away and nuclear power has a bad press on most voters.
    i know a place for the nuclear waste: in your Mouth and now: swallow it!


    QUOTE=josvazg;231307]
    Contrary to what you'd expect, the ones complaining are the ones that WILL NOT have the nuclear plant or waste treatment complex near, but the ones that will have it relatively far away. The ones that live with a nuclear power plant nearby don't want it to go away and other even ask for it to come along.
    So now you know![/QUOTE]

    sure now i know you are a castor transporter.



    QUOTE=josvazg;231307]
    Do you want to be GREENER?, just do like they do in Spain!
    But later don't complain you pollution and unemployment rises.
    Spain has many problems, but the expensive, inefficient and TOO-Green Energy sector is NOT the least of them. It is probably one of our top 3 biggest problems.
    Do you really want to imitate us? Think again,[/QUOTE]

    if i want it greener then i paint the coal power plant green and i turn nuclear power plants into a child theme park!





    Last edited by Qaridarium; 10-10-2011 at 10:10 AM.

  3. #273
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    http://www.solarserver.de/solar-maga...euerbaren.html







    E = g * ρ2 * 2 * Pi * r4

    ". Die Kosten pro Kilowattstunde liegen mit 0,24€ weit unterhalb der 50€, die für Pumpspeicherkraftwerke üblich sind. "

    "the cost of this storage power plant is 0,24€ and its much cheaper than water fall storage power plant with 50€ per kw/h"

  4. #274
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    Why are you so pissed?

    Well, I can understand, people resort to insults and rude comments when they don't know how to hold their case anymore.
    So sad...

    Let's review wind power:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wind_power
    uh oh surprise surprise!
    Spain just right behind Germany... AS I SAID. Sorry to prove you wrong!
    (2010) Top World Installed power 1 China, 2 USA, 3 Germany, 4 Spain... 10 Denmark with less than 1/4 of Spain figures. I am sorry!

    (2010) EU top 10 wind electricity: 1 Spain, 2 Germany....6 Denmark UUUPS I was wrong, Spain was NOT second on this one. But anyway, Denmark is not even 3rd.

    Solar, should I compare solar energy Spain vs Denmark?
    Do they even see the sun up there? (well yes but not so often as down here, I am sorry!)
    Ok...I could not find figures, but here:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_power
    Try to find Spain and count how many times it appears... then count Denmark, well Denmark is NOT mentioned!
    Big surprise!

    The fact is that renewable energy is still quite "rough in the edges" today, and our better chance to stop or reduce consumption of fuels like oil or coal is Nuclear Power.

    Fision Nuclear Power TODAY has a lot of problems, but produces solid waste that you can at least contain and handle later. Coal and oil plants produce wast you cannot contain nor control. Yes, even solar-coal factory burn coal in the end!

    Maybe in the future, a new battery technology will allow solar and wind plants to act nearly as proper energy plants and provide energy right when its needed. Maybe some other enhancements of technologies will add as well so that we can use more of renewables.

    Maybe in the future we could fully reuse nuclear fision waste into second-generation plants that produce energy and wastes that only last some 50 to 100years.

    Or Maybe in the future we'll master fusion, and all our problems are solved.

    Or, who knows, maybe a new technology comes along and makes all the other obsolete.

    But now a days you cannot drop nuclear altogether nor should you subsidize (nor limit) green energy by law.

    R&D should continue on the energy field WITHOUT religious wars, on all fields, so that we may find better ways (fully renewable or not) to produce energy in the future.

  5. #275
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    Quote Originally Posted by josvazg View Post
    Why are you so pissed?
    i'm not pissed i found a solution for you....

  6. #276
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    http://www.eike-klima-energie.eu/new...omspeicherung/



    Ringwall storage hybrid power plant

  7. #277
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    Quote Originally Posted by josvazg View Post
    Let's review wind power:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wind_power
    uh oh surprise surprise!
    Spain just right behind Germany... AS I SAID. Sorry to prove you wrong!
    (2010) Top World Installed power 1 China, 2 USA, 3 Germany, 4 Spain... 10 Denmark with less than 1/4 of Spain figures. I am sorry!

    (2010) EU top 10 wind electricity: 1 Spain, 2 Germany....6 Denmark UUUPS I was wrong, Spain was NOT second on this one. But anyway, Denmark is not even 3rd.
    you are wrong because:

    wind energy divided by the country-area
    wind energy divided by the number of people

  8. #278
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    Interesting...
    I can't read German, but I guess it's all about one of those future technologies we may find and that I was talking about.

    There is only a few problems with this thing:

    - It's not TODAY's technology, let's just hope it's doable and we can have it soon.
    - To be a real alternative to traditional power plant technology it has to be able to be installed just as easily as you install a traditional power plant. I mean it should not be as restrictive as today's waterfall power plants, which are great, but cannot be placed wherever you like (that is their biggest problem) and are very costly to install both in terms of money and the changes you need to do on the surroundings (move the water through another path, etc)

  9. #279
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    Quote Originally Posted by josvazg View Post
    Interesting...
    I can't read German, but I guess it's all about one of those future technologies we may find and that I was talking about.

    There is only a few problems with this thing:

    - It's not TODAY's technology, let's just hope it's doable and we can have it soon.
    - To be a real alternative to traditional power plant technology it has to be able to be installed just as easily as you install a traditional power plant. I mean it should not be as restrictive as today's waterfall power plants, which are great, but cannot be placed wherever you like (that is their biggest problem) and are very costly to install both in terms of money and the changes you need to do on the surroundings (move the water through another path, etc)
    hi i know you enjoy !

    "It's not TODAY's technology"

    Yes it is Today's Technology! thats all about in this articles.

  10. #280
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qaridarium View Post
    you are wrong because:

    wind energy divided by the country-area
    wind energy divided by the number of people
    I was talking about countries ranking, not "per-capitas"!
    The rankings are done per countries usually, but hey, just twist it whatever you like.

    And, in the solar field, there is not even a Denmark mention on the wikipedia nor it has any of the biggest solar plants in the world, as Spain does.

    I am sorry you just found out that Spain is a bigger player in solar and wind installed base and energy production as you thought!

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