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Thread: It's Easy To Guess What Angers GNOME Users

  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by josian_220 View Post
    I think that most GNOME-Shell haters miss the point when they make a comparison of the lack of customization like in KDE.
    The "lack of customization" is actually a feature. Every time I use KDE it makes me want to throttle people. Instead of picking something that works they force the users to choose between a mishmash of broken and conflicting functionality.

    I want to get stuff done on the desktop. The less tweaking I need to do the better off I am.

    The odd part about bitching about customization is that Gnome 3 is actually FAR more capable, flexible, and open to modifications then Gnome 2 ever could dream to be.

    'Linux power users' shouldn't need pages and pages and pages of tick boxes and confusing dialogs to be able to customize their desktops. People who are not power users will just get confused and lost with such horrible configuration GUIs.

    Let KDE be KDE. I don't want Gnome 3 to be KDE. There are good reasons I have no desire to use KDE at all. People that like KDE can stick with it and count their blessings.

  2. #42
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    To all the "gnome-is-great" 'tards in here:

    Those of us who despise gnome-shell are basing their perception of it on the fact that it is BLOODY SELF-CENTERED USELESSNESS.

    The DE should NOT be "in your face". It should make it EASY to accomplish what you are trying to do, and then GET THE HELL OUT OF MY WAY. What they've done is made it exactly the opposite of what it should be. They've made a bloated big thick ugly slow pain in the ass -- they're trying to make use of a computer ALL ABOUT THEM, when their purpose is to FACILITATE, not conquer.

    That is what was beautiful about gnome-panel. It was small, it was functional. It categorized things logically and made it easy to get where you want to go.

    Gnome-shell is the product of some whiny attention whores with an inferiority complex. They want it to be about THEM. I'm sorry gnome-devs, but I don't use a computer to see pretty gnome, I use it to actually accomplish tasks. If you're going to get in my way, you are going to be eliminated in favor of something that does what it is supposed to do.



    The big problems with gnome-shell are the result of a bunch of VERY poor design decisions.
    1) It doesn't do anything special that it requires compositing. It may be "pretty", but it just makes it SLOW and UNRELIABLE.
    2) It most DEFINITELY should NOT take up the entire display area. The bigger the area it takes, the further the user has to chase across the screen to get what they're after.
    3) It should NOT require flipping across the screen 17 times and 273 mouse clicks to launch firefox.
    4) It would be nice to have an easy way to see what programs are running and switch between them rather than opening that insane big ugly bloated mess (one click), and switching into (whatever they call the stupid mode where every open window is shown in microscopic overview so you can't tell the difference between them), you know, something like a WINDOW LIST PANEL!!!!
    5) How about a PARENT DIRECTORY BUTTON IN NAUTILUS???!?!?!!?! Instead, you open, say "Desktop" and you're TRAPPED there....
    6) The "Every bloody .desktop thrown into a single category" category is a completely useless MESS. GET RID OF IT!!!!! -- but no, instead, they're getting rid of EVERY OTHER category, and will ONLY be showing the "holy shit" category. Now, rather than logically finding the application I'm after by its category, I have to scan the hard way through 10 THOUSAND ICONS IN ONE BLOODY MESS. WTF ARE THEY THINKING???!?!?!


    So, the process of fixing gnome-shell;
    1) get rid of compositing, or at least make it OPTIONAL.
    2) Less screen space taken up by uselessness.
    3) One click to open the menu, one click to select the category, one click to open the program.
    *** here's a decent idea.... how about a FREQUENTLY USED category?
    4) lower panel showing running applications.
    5) add a ".." button to nautilus.
    6) remove the "holy shit" category, keep the rest of the categories.

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by droidhacker View Post
    To all the "gnome-is-great" 'tards in here:

    Those of us who despise gnome-shell are basing their perception of it on the fact that it is BLOODY SELF-CENTERED USELESSNESS.

    The DE should NOT be "in your face". It should make it EASY to accomplish what you are trying to do, and then GET THE HELL OUT OF MY WAY. What they've done is made it exactly the opposite of what it should be. They've made a bloated big thick ugly slow pain in the ass
    Actually, Gnome 3 has only one bar instead of two, is lighter on the options, uses less RAM, stays more out of the way etc. in comparison to Gnome 2.

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by droidhacker View Post
    To all the "gnome-is-great" 'tards in here:

    Those of us who despise gnome-shell are basing their perception of it on the fact that it is BLOODY SELF-CENTERED USELESSNESS.

    The DE should NOT be "in your face". It should make it EASY to accomplish what you are trying to do, and then GET THE HELL OUT OF MY WAY. What they've done is made it exactly the opposite of what it should be. They've made a bloated big thick ugly slow pain in the ass -- they're trying to make use of a computer ALL ABOUT THEM, when their purpose is to FACILITATE, not conquer.

    That is what was beautiful about gnome-panel. It was small, it was functional. It categorized things logically and made it easy to get where you want to go.

    Gnome-shell is the product of some whiny attention whores with an inferiority complex. They want it to be about THEM. I'm sorry gnome-devs, but I don't use a computer to see pretty gnome, I use it to actually accomplish tasks. If you're going to get in my way, you are going to be eliminated in favor of something that does what it is supposed to do.




    The big problems with gnome-shell are the result of a bunch of VERY poor design decisions.
    1) It doesn't do anything special that it requires compositing. It may be "pretty", but it just makes it SLOW and UNRELIABLE.
    2) It most DEFINITELY should NOT take up the entire display area. The bigger the area it takes, the further the user has to chase across the screen to get what they're after.
    3) It should NOT require flipping across the screen 17 times and 273 mouse clicks to launch firefox.
    4) It would be nice to have an easy way to see what programs are running and switch between them rather than opening that insane big ugly bloated mess (one click), and switching into (whatever they call the stupid mode where every open window is shown in microscopic overview so you can't tell the difference between them), you know, something like a WINDOW LIST PANEL!!!!
    5) How about a PARENT DIRECTORY BUTTON IN NAUTILUS???!?!?!!?! Instead, you open, say "Desktop" and you're TRAPPED there....
    6) The "Every bloody .desktop thrown into a single category" category is a completely useless MESS. GET RID OF IT!!!!! -- but no, instead, they're getting rid of EVERY OTHER category, and will ONLY be showing the "holy shit" category. Now, rather than logically finding the application I'm after by its category, I have to scan the hard way through 10 THOUSAND ICONS IN ONE BLOODY MESS. WTF ARE THEY THINKING???!?!?!


    So, the process of fixing gnome-shell;
    1) get rid of compositing, or at least make it OPTIONAL.
    2) Less screen space taken up by uselessness.
    3) One click to open the menu, one click to select the category, one click to open the program.
    *** here's a decent idea.... how about a FREQUENTLY USED category?
    4) lower panel showing running applications.
    5) add a ".." button to nautilus.
    6) remove the "holy shit" category, keep the rest of the categories.
    This post is so stupid and hyperbolic I can't even begin to describe it. Why am I a tard for liking gnome 3? GET OVER YOURSELF you self-centered prick. And gnome 3 is designed to stay out of your way and let you focus on the task at hand, thats the whole fucking point behind gnome-shell's design.

    By default gnome-shell is one of the most minimalistic DE's out there, it takes up less space than the default gnome 2 setup... How is space being wasted by uselessness? Two bars on the top and bottom in the era of widescreen monitors is "uselessness". You can say a lot of things about gnome 3 but its certainly not "in your face" and "distracting"

    If you are scanning through thousands of icons you are doing it wrong, use the damn search. And your "frequently used" apps belong on the dock, thats what its there for.
    Last edited by bwat47; 10-18-2011 at 01:35 PM.

  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by drag View Post
    The "lack of customization" is actually a feature. Every time I use KDE it makes me want to throttle people. Instead of picking something that works they force the users to choose between a mishmash of broken and conflicting functionality.

    I want to get stuff done on the desktop. The less tweaking I need to do the better off I am.
    Incorrect. The alternative is "too many options" is called "sane defaults." The ability for tweaking should be there, but the defaults should target the largest amount of users possible. And those groups who find those defaults unacceptable can put out their own spins or derivatives, or heck even just post a script to set those defaults one time.

  6. #46
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    "I'd only change one thing: Stop assuming that users are retarded. ..."
    Judging from the quality of many of these comments I'm starting to think that designing for retards might not be such a bad idea after all...

    But seriously, people should try to be more constructive and perhaps name a few things they don't like and suggest how it can be improved. Posting useless "this shit sucks"-comments isn't helping anyone.

  7. #47
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    Default I learned an important lesson today... most people shouldn't have choices

    Don't like the Gnome 3 DE? Rage the most incomprehensible, non-helpful criticisms into your keyboard and threaten to leave for KDE or Xfce.

    Don't like the Windows DE? Too bad, you're stuck with it. Suck it up and deal with it.

    Until someone can thoroughly explain what it is about Gnome 3 that they hate so much, I'm going to remain convinced that people are just being resistant to change and just need to get used to it. Besides, how is it getting in your way? You click stuff to bring up other stuff so you can do stuff with your computer. How does Gnome 3 get in your way of doing that?

    My pro's and con's:
    Pro's:

    I like how the dock/shell is kept hidden until you flick your mouse to the top-right or hit the windows key. It leaves more room on the screen for other windows. The only persistent thing on the screen is the top bar.

    Integrating online accounts like Gmail/Facebook into Evolution/Empathy is a pretty good idea. It still doesn't work, but it'll be convenient when it does.

    Con's:
    The system tray is a bit clunky. Clicking on tray icon might do one thing, and clicking on the text might do something different. It's inconsistent and needs to be reworked. Also, the icon needs to be on the right side of the text.

    Some programs like Evolution need to be able to be minimized to the tray. Most of the time, I don't want to look at Evolution, I don't even want to see it, until it has something for me.

  8. #48
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    Default Gnome Fallback is the classic mode!

    As a response to all of the posted survey responses by those wanting a Classic Gnome option to be available, the classic Gnome Panel is still there and has actually had an update which results in some saner panel applet placement. It is called the "Gnome Fallback" mode, and it is by default toggled when Gnome encounters graphics hardware that can not utilize the Shell, but it is also available to everyone from System Settings. Simply put, it is a direct port of the old Panel to Gnome 3 with some updates and a few aesthetics changes.

    http://www.vuntz.net/journal/post/20...ve-gnome-panel!

    This mode has actually improved quite a bit over the past year, and now is almost a completely capable Gnome 2.x replacement. All of the official applets are available, the panels are just as configurable as ever (just press the alt key while right clicking), and there are even some specific panel themes available. You can use composting with this mode if you wish, with both Mutter and Compiz being fully able to work with it. Bugs in this mode do get found and are fixed upstream, unlike if you stick with old Gnome 2.x or use a potential fork.

    Here is a screenshot of me using the mode last Saturday, with some tweaks made possible by the Tweak tool, some easy to do tweaks to the default theme, and utilizing Mutter for composting:



    I am also currently working on my own theme which looks almost exactly old Gnome 2.x session on Fedora. It is still a work in progress, but I will release it on Gnome Look once Fedora 16 is released. And despite all of this, I am not even Anti-Gnome Shell, but I do want the Fallback mode to be all it can be as well.

  9. #49

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    Quote Originally Posted by droidhacker View Post
    Problem: It doesn't do anything special that it requires compositing. It may be "pretty", but it just makes it SLOW and UNRELIABLE.
    Solution: get rid of compositing, or at least make it OPTIONAL.
    Compositing is already optional, just use the fallback mode. And the "pretty", or "bling bling" as I call it, while not directly useful, it's a great factor for new, non-power, users (people just like pretty things...).

    Quote Originally Posted by droidhacker View Post
    Problem: It most DEFINITELY should NOT take up the entire display area. The bigger the area it takes, the further the user has to chase across the screen to get what they're after.
    Solution: Less screen space taken up by uselessness.
    I assume your talking about the activities screen. If that's the case, you're right, but your solution is not the best. Instead of using less screen space, you should be able to increase/decrease the icon's and button's size. Personally, I think the size is perfect and I'm using a 1080p screen.

    Quote Originally Posted by droidhacker View Post
    Problem: It should NOT require flipping across the screen 17 times and 273 mouse clicks to launch firefox.
    Solution: One click to open the menu, one click to select the category, one click to open the program.
    *** here's a decent idea.... how about a FREQUENTLY USED category?
    Hrrr....I think you're not using gnome-shell :S For example I launch firefox with 7 key strokes (Window button, f, i, r, e, f, Enter) or with 3 mouse movements and 2 mouse clicks (probably more with a small screen), and even with 1 mouse movement and 1 mouse click if you have firefox in the dock, which is almost the same as your "frequently used" category.

    Quote Originally Posted by droidhacker View Post
    Problem: It would be nice to have an easy way to see what programs are running and switch between them rather than opening that insane big ugly bloated mess (one click), and switching into (whatever they call the stupid mode where every open window is shown in microscopic overview so you can't tell the difference between them), you know, something like a WINDOW LIST PANEL!!!!
    Solution: lower panel showing running applications.
    Have you ever heard of Alt-Tab? And I think you can see the open programs in your dock. And their bloated mess (the activities screen I guess) is really great for mouse users because the icons are quite big. You probably have a small screen or a lot of programs open at the same time. If it's the latest, then put your programs into several workspaces.
    By the way, your solution is junk, because it will take permanent space from the display. You don't see Areo, Aqua, KDE, *box with 2 bars don't you?

    Quote Originally Posted by droidhacker View Post
    Problem: How about a PARENT DIRECTORY BUTTON IN NAUTILUS???!?!?!!?! Instead, you open, say "Desktop" and you're TRAPPED there....
    Solution: add a ".." button to nautilus.
    Hrrr.....I don't recall having this problem, but I don't think your solution is the best. Instead of ".." button, why not a "up arrow" button and use Ctrl+"Up arrow" as a keyboard shortcut.

    Quote Originally Posted by droidhacker View Post
    Problem: The "Every bloody .desktop thrown into a single category" category is a completely useless MESS. GET RID OF IT!!!!! -- but no, instead, they're getting rid of EVERY OTHER category, and will ONLY be showing the "holy shit" category. Now, rather than logically finding the application I'm after by its category, I have to scan the hard way through 10 THOUSAND ICONS IN ONE BLOODY MESS. WTF ARE THEY THINKING???!?!?!
    Solution: remove the "holy shit" category, keep the rest of the categories.
    Honestly I don't understand your problem here, but in gnome 3.2, the activities screen has the categories listed on the right side. Besides, if you use your keyboard to launch an application, you don't need to care about the categories.

  10. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vax456 View Post
    Don't like the Gnome 3 DE? Rage the most incomprehensible, non-helpful criticisms into your keyboard and threaten to leave for KDE or Xfce.

    Don't like the Windows DE? Too bad, you're stuck with it. Suck it up and deal with it.

    Until someone can thoroughly explain what it is about Gnome 3 that they hate so much, I'm going to remain convinced that people are just being resistant to change and just need to get used to it. Besides, how is it getting in your way? You click stuff to bring up other stuff so you can do stuff with your computer. How does Gnome 3 get in your way of doing that?
    I do like your comparison with Windows and Linux... HEHE, If you don't like the GDM in Windows, your screwed :-D. With Linux, you do have choice.

    What I don't like about Gnome is the extra amount of actions it takes to get from place to place. Same with Unity. I have CTS and I find it painful to have to keep wheeling my mouse to the top left to get a panel open so i can search (More movement and typing) for my applications. With Gnome 2 and KDE (And every other WM out there), I can set up icons on the desktop and panel and simply click on them to open and I also have a task bar where I can simply click on the minimized application to bring it up front. Far fewer mouse or hand movements than Unity or Gnome Shell where you have to either move the mouse to the top left, then back down, then click the applications - try this while working with multiple apps at the same time. ALT-Tab works, but can be quite painful with 30 to 40 apps open and trying to alt-tab-click through them all trying to find the right app you are looking for. With KDE and Gnome 2 (And every other WM out there), all your apps are neatly stacked on the task bar ready to click once.

    With Gnome Shell and Unity, there is simply too much movement for my arm and hands to handle.

    As far as looks go, it looks nice, but KDE has much, much, much smoother animation on my Laptop than Unity Or Gnome shell.

    But, to each his/her own. I was an avid Gnome user for 4-5 years and I just find I can't physically use it anymore. So, back to KDE and I am glad I am back. Lots of nostalgia for me also as I started live on Linux with KDE back in the late 90's :-D.

    Joe

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