Yup I've read about it... weren't several lawsuits filed (and won) against Intel because of this? I think it's still happening, but Intel has enough money to cover it up. Intel can be very, very evil.
Originally Posted by jrch2k8
And it's not just for AMD CPUs. The Intel compiler would limit code on all non-Intel CPUs, including VIA, etc.
@jrch2k8 I have to agree with most of what you said especially since console games are ported something ugly to PC not to mention we're using Interpreted code for everything horraayy!
I would of loved to see my lowly 3870k stomp the hell out of these new processors with a IGP only shootout
How did you get an Ivy Bridge CPU so early??? Lucky bastard!
I can't even find one online. ANYWHERE! They literally are not in stores.
It's not fully correct. You could already buy it for >1 week or so. Some dealers just sold em as soon as they got the chips But now it should be easy to get those chips.
Actually, while I am extremely excited about geeky things like tri-gate transistors and PCI-E 3.0 and USB 3.0, I'm still not convinced that moving to a "Mainstream" Ivy Bridge box right now would be a good move for me. Ivy Bridge rings false to my ears, at least this initial release; I think I need to wait for Ivy Bridge-EP which are their "Enthusiast Performance" chips due (much ) later this year.
Originally Posted by elanthis
Michael's Windows-side Release Day Review Site Competitor, Toms Hardware
Well, let me take a step back and state where I stand.
Originally Posted by Toms Hardware
- Desktop system, full ATX but a "mini tower" (I don't need 9 hard drive bays with a full ATX tower)
- I use just about every piece of software that exists. Windows, Linux, games, video encoding, word processing, compiling large codebases, watching HD video, watching stereoscopic 3d video, you name it. Spend about 6 days of the week on the Linux side of the house (always a very recent / beta distro ), but I have been dual booting for years because I can't quite fully eliminate Windows.
- Core i7 920 "Bloomfield" (first-generation Core i7; falls into the "performance" category but not the "enthusiast" category)
- 16GB 1066 MHz Dual-Channel DDR3, although I'd be willing to re-purchase triple-channel or quad-channel memory when I next upgrade
- Asus P6T Deluxe, which is the Intel X58 Express chipset -- basically an enthusiast high-end mobo
- A smattering of Western Digital SATA 3Gb/s HDDs, variously connected by internal SATA or eSATA to an external enclosure. All 7200rpm with 32MB or 64MB cache, sizes varying from 2TB to 500GB (currently only using a 2TB and a 1.5TB for most tasks). About five disks in total, I think, but most of them are idle 95% of the time. I have my main Linux desktop on the 2TB, and my main Windows desktop on the 1.5TB. Naturally I can mount NTFS-3g from Linux, but I can't mount EXT4 with extents from Windows.
- Corsair HX-1000 PSU, which fully supports PCI-E 2.1 (dunno about 3.0) and is powerful and reliable enough to probably run GTX 680 in SLI. Super reliable and the most expensive PSU on the market when I bought it 3-4 years ago
- Brand new Sapphire Radeon HD7970, picked it up about a month ago now? Couldn't have been much longer since it just launched recently...
Things that make me happy about my current system:
- Absolutely powers through games, because most games go easy on the CPU but aren't afraid to tax the GPU. That's fine; I've got probably the best single-chip GPU out there, so bring it on.
- GPU gets very good OpenCL performance on benchmarks, especially workloads tuned to primarily torture the GPU and not really the CPU or memory or disk.
- Daily computing tasks such as anything web browser-related, word processing, etc. work as well as I want them to, and I know that faster specs won't make this any more enjoyable or productive because it's already lightning fast.
- Virtualization performance with VMware Workstation is good, as long as I'm not doing anything crazy in the guest. I've been known to play with kernel code in a VM, because I'm loathe to have my disks repeatedly parking their heads as I turn the system on and off due to my bad coding practices (I'd be rebooting/power cycling a lot if I were doing kernel devel on the physical box)
Things that make me about my current system:
- Realistic OpenCL workloads are bottlenecked by the non-GPU parts of the system: for I/O bound (disk, memory) or CPU bound workloads, the GPU basically sits there snoring at 0 - 10% utilization while the rest of the system catches up. My GPU completely outclasses everything else in my system. I want to change that.
- My 1.5TB and 2TB commodity SATA 3Gb/s hard disks are nothing special, at your typical 7200rpm and in a JBOD configuration (I don't have a hardware RAID controller and I dislike software RAID). I/O performance is very limited for some of my more special workloads, like video encoding and live capture.
- My memory bandwidth sucks! I wanted a lot of RAM for virtualization and video processing, but I couldn't shell out the cash for 1600 MHz triple channel RAM, which both my current CPU and motherboard support. So I'm getting pretty poor performance out of video encoding because of that, combined with the poor disk throughput.
- I want USB 3.0! A packetized protocol that can go faster than SATA II... wooooow. I'm salivating. I might splurge for an SSD or a hybrid disk and do my video processing on that, to eliminate the disk bottleneck. Just a thought.
- I want PCI-E 3.0! My video card supports it, but it's downgraded to PCI-E 2.1 compatibility mode right now, because my mobo/CPU doesn't support PCI-E 3.0.
Things that make me about the first batch of Ivy Bridge:
- Don't want no integrated graphics, mmkay? This is a workstation/power desktop. I don't have room on my CPU die for integrated graphics. I have a $580 graphics card dedicated to graphics. I don't need more graphics. I need CPU throughput, and ridiculous amounts of it. Even if I could get the graphics core of Ivy Bridge simultaneously executing my OpenCL workload alongside my GPU, it wouldn't amount to a fart in a collander in terms of performance, because the 7970 sooooo incredibly out-classes Ivy Bridge's graphics core in terms of compute power.
- I want at LEAST triple channel RAM for the memory bandwidth, if not quad channel. Trust me, compiling and video encoding -- two tasks that are becoming increasingly common for me -- will gobble that dual channel memory bandwidth right up. Why have a super-fast CPU if it spends all of its time waiting for space on the memory controller? These first Ivy Bridge chips are exclusively dual channel.
- Couldn't they have at least splurged for a 6-core in the initial release? 4 really powerful cores is well and good, but I can actually use a larger number of threads, you know. Compiling is an obvious one, so is video encoding, and -- heck -- the way Chrome's going these days, you may as well give each tab the better part of a core. I've got background tabs right now eating up 1-3% CPU apiece, idle. Whew. Oh, and being able to actually multitask on the host with a guest VM doing something interesting is going to take more power than I've got -- right now I pretty much have to choose between a busy host and a busy guest, can't have both.
- As shown by Michael's benchmarks, any workload that scales well with threads is going to cause the previous-generation Sandy Bridge EP processors to obliterate these first Ivy Bridge chips.
Things that make me in general:
- While a Sandy Bridge EP processor like the 3930K would be right down my alley in terms of price, L3 cache, memory bandwidth and number of cores, it falls short in the arenas of USB 3.0 and PCI-E 3.0. So even if I got one of those motherboards that supports USB 3.0 and PCI-E 3.0 through an on-board chipset, I've found those chipsets to be generally buggier and slower than having these critical components on-die with the CPU. I trust Intel with these important tasks much more than I trust an Asus or Asrock. Put them on the CPU, pleez. Oh, wait -- that's Ivy Bridge
- The 3930K would be my "right now" processor, but I'd have massive Ivy Bridge EP envy when it lands. Have you guys heard of the engineering sample 10-core CPU with hyperthreading? That's 20 threads! And I'm sure each one is sizzling hot with at least a 130 W TDP (like Sandy Bridge EP), quad channel DDR3, and all the goodies. That's what I really want. But it isn't here, yet.
I guess I can hold on with my Bloomfield box until Ivy Bridge EP arrives, but I've got money now, and an established familial hand-me-down system, and the person who is going to be the recipient of my Bloomfield is chomping at the bit to get rid of his (by now) antiquated Core 2 Quad box with a GT200-era mid-range GeForce.
Also, I'm a little worried that the price gouging on the Ivy Bridge EP stuff is going to be so intense that I might not be able to afford it until it's already well into its sweet spot of the lifespan. I'm thinking, you know, $400 motherboards, $800 CPUs (and not even the top-end one), and RAM that you can throw away another $800 - $1000 on. I'm keeping my GPU, so that's a load off my shoulders, but this stuff is really going to bleed me dry if I go Ivy EP.
So, with this insanely long and rambling post coming to a close, what are your opinions? Do you think I should jump ship and get Ivy Bridge now, which would basically mean buying a 3770K and a Panther Point mobo? Should I settle for the dual channel and save a few bucks, maybe the better to spend on a SATA 6Gb/s SSD?
Or, should I wait until god-knows-when to grab the Holy Grail of workstation computing in our time, also known as Ivy Bridge EP?
Do you think I'll be able to resist my impulsive urges to buy Ivy now, or will I just order it and beat myself up over the dual channel RAM as I patiently wait for videos to encode and compiles to finish for the next 2-3 years?
TELL ME THE ANSWER TO THIS TERRIBLE CONUNDRUM.
Most users oc the i7-920, you did not? When you don't use the integrated gfx you don't get much from faster ram, so you could still use your ddr3-1066 rams. But your chipset was definitely NOT for dual channel, but for triple channel optimizied, so you lost speed with only 2 modules. Next thing: you can certainly access ext4 (readonly) using win and
For my usecases this is enough, but depends on what you do. For PCI-E 3.0 a new Nv GTX 680 could use it, but in your example you said you would like to use SLI. The Z77 chipset can use only 8 lanes then, but your X58 chipset provides 2 x 16x so in SLI mode the X58 definitely provides the same bandwith.
Then usb 3.0 on Z77 and so: the difference to a very cheap 2-port nec addon card is not worth to get it. i have got nec 2-port and via 4-port addon cards. the via ones are definitely much more painful, dont get those 4port.
If you already oc your i7-920 i see no real reason to change the system. Replacing the gfx cards and adding a 3rd ram module and maybe an addon card for usb 3.0 would be smarter.
Ivy Bridge contains DRM. Still
Is it only me who cares about "DRM inside" "feature" of Ivy Bridge?
Intel calls it "Intel Insider", but it is no more than marketing cover.
Nope, my 920 isn't OCed. Maybe I should burn it up before I hand it down, I'm sure it's got plenty of life left in it if I don't OC it Wonder how much more perf I can get if I OC it and whether it's worth the risk... I only have the standard CPU fan on it although my case's cooling fans are many and large (240mm and several 120mm).
Originally Posted by Kano
I know. When I first got my i7-920 and this motherboard, I slotted 6 GB of DDR3 1066 Triple-Channel. They didn't have capacities back then like they do today, so getting more wasn't really feasible (or at least not economical). Nowadays it's dirt cheap to get 16GB of dual channel, but still expensive to get 16GB of triple channel (about twice the price!).
Originally Posted by Kano
Oh, this does support extents now? Used to be that if you enabled extents, ext2fsd wouldn't be able to read your filesystem, or would break it if it did...
Originally Posted by Kano
I don't actually want to use SLI, I was just saying that I can technically support it with my PSU, and there's room in my case. But no. And I'm not changing away from my HD7970
Originally Posted by Kano
Thanks, I'll think about maybe getting the NEC one. What's so bad about the VIA one? Crap drivers? (This would be about what I'd expect from VIA...)
Originally Posted by Kano
I don't OC the 920, but I could try it and see if it doesn't die on me. I'm not going to replace my HD7970 for a loooong time so that's out of the question.
What really annoys me is that if I get triple channel RAM for my current platform now, I would have to upgrade to quad channel again when I eventually upgrade to Ivy Bridge EP... right? And I don't want to go to Sandy Bridge EP because it doesn't have the killer features I want. So I'm kind of stuck in the Bermuda Triangle here, where anything I do (even doing nothing at all) is annoying and detrimental. For this reason I'll probably just do nothing until Ivy Bridge EP, then upgrade to that.