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Thread: Gentoo Announces Eudev Project -- Its Udev Fork

  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by asdx View Post
    So in other words: Fuck you Lennart and your evil plans.
    How exactly are his plans of heavily advancing of init and daemon integration evil? Its like saying fuck you to Wayland.

    The only thing he did was to show where eudev developers were wrong or FUDing.

    He dropped BSD and kernels that did not provide required for PulseAudio inkernel features to reduce the balance of support and allow faster development by concentrating on Linux.

    Same is with Systemd.

    Anyone preventing BSD and co adapting PulseAudio or Systemd? Nobody. He is also not obligated to do this work for them. They are also free to catch up later, directly using already ripe system.

    Nothing is wrong with eudev either.

  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by asdx View Post
    So in other words: Fuck you Lennart and your evil plans.
    I don't get all this grief Lennart has been getting. What is it that people have against unified, integrated, and sane, management of userspace? init.d has been one of the big ugly warts on the face of Linux. I have no problem with giving initd the boot. (OMG, I made a pun...) Good riddance.

    This has more to do with poor handling of regressions to do with firmware loading than anything to do with developing udev and systemd in the same tree. Remember that systemd is so heavily dependant on udev, that it was hard to keep support for features between the two synced. Had the regressions not been handled so poorly, I don't think this udev fork business would have a leg to stand on.

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by asdx View Post
    Wayland is a different story, and I have nothing against it.

    Please explain how this is NOT evil:

    Quote Originally Posted by Lennart Poettering
    (Yes, udev on non-systemd systems is in our eyes a dead end, in case you
    haven't noticed it yet. I am looking forward to the day when we can drop
    that support entirely.)
    http://lists.freedesktop.org/archive...st/006066.html

    They were obviously trying to bring some disadvantage to the many init systems that were using udevd just fine, and trying to force systemd on everyone.

    I like systemd because it offers some nice features, but I find this act of trying to put others into a disadvantage very disappointing, and I don't tolerate this in FOSS, because FOSS is about choice, it's not about anti-competitive practices like this. Leave those evil practices to companies like Microsoft.

    I'm glad Gentoo developers decided to fork udev.
    Systemd and udev are opensource. That alone makes them different with Microsoft.
    He also said, "he would be happy to drop supporting udev for non-systemd" because "its a dead end". Why should he do that he does not want? Anyone is free to step in, which eudev did.
    He can have his opinion, just as eudev developers have own opinion. The only stupid thing here is if they clash their opinions and burn own energy.

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by crazycheese View Post
    Systemd and udev are opensource. That alone makes them different with Microsoft.
    He also said, "he would be happy to drop supporting udev for non-systemd" because "its a dead end". Why should he do that he does not want? Anyone is free to step in, which eudev did.
    He can have his opinion, just as eudev developers have own opinion. The only stupid thing here is if they clash their opinions and burn own energy.
    Open source dosn't inclue honorfull acting and courage, I my opionion id woud better to work together with the BSDs guys rather than making more and ore differences between Unix-like systems.

  5. #45
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    man, i wish people wouldn't quote asdx ~ everyone knows he just just going to make some FU <insert name> comment in almost any thread. The guy _never_ has anything even remotely interesting/relevant to say, it's just the same old predictable non-sense that comes out of his mouth...

    ...that is the one downside to adding people to your ignore list ~ the ignore list doesn't tie into people quoting them :\

  6. #46
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    @ninez: Sorry.

    @asdx: Udev is integral part of Systemd, I think Systemd will even dissolve Udev in the process. At some point maintaining all legacy burden is just slowing things down. This was already case with PulseAudio. I am with Lennart on this one, although he could have said it in much more respectable manner and asked for someone interested to fork standalone udev.

    The message was simply - "I do not want to maintain all platforms, I pick only Linux". But everyone is free to update/integrate it in own ecosystems or fork it. Have BSD guys ported ZFS to Linux as part of their efforts? No. But no one on BSD side prevented ZFS on Linux from happening either.

    @Thaodan:"Open source dosn't inclue honorfull acting and courage, I my opionion id woud better to work together with the BSDs guys rather than making more and ore differences between Unix-like systems."
    Why? BSD already have better system. Its called MacOSX.
    Last edited by crazycheese; 12-21-2012 at 10:46 AM.

  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by crazycheese View Post
    @ninez: Sorry.
    No need to apologize Mr.Cheese, it's not your fault that 'ignore' doesn't cover quoting

    I just thought i would point out how futile it can be to deal with asdx and the limitation of 'ignore list'. (i probably worded it a bit silly in retrospect though - ie: it's not like i have some expectation that just because i have put him on ignore - everyone else has..lol ). but any time he starts to show promise, like in a few cases - ie: where he seems to acknowledge that his behavior is undesirable - within a few posts <like clockwork> he goes right back to the same old crap.

    but who knows, maybe asdx has been improving over the last couple of months (i wouldn't know, but his comment would suggest that most likely, he has not.)

    anyway, enough of that

    cheerz

  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by ryao View Post
    How is it problematic?
    Because he works for Red Hat which actually needs systemd to fix their incredibly fucked boot times.

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by crazycheese View Post
    Systemd and udev are opensource. That alone makes them different with Microsoft.
    ASP.NET MVC, NuGet, IronPython, IronRuby, etc are all under open source licenses.
    These days even Microsoft are doing some open source.

  10. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by crazycheese View Post

    @Thaodan:"Open source dosn't inclue honorfull acting and courage, I my opionion id woud better to work together with the BSDs guys rather than making more and ore differences between Unix-like systems."
    Why? BSD already have better system. Its called MacOSX.
    OS X is not BSD.

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