Upstream X/Wayland Developers Bash Canonical, Mir

[squirrl]

My favorite line in the whole thing...
(upstart came first, Red Hat adopted it, then systemd came along claiming that there were technical issues with upstart. So this is almost an exact mirror, with the shoe on the other foot.)

For the anti-BSD trolls:
This is the first display server I know of to be licensed as (L)GPL3. I doubt it will be popular anywhere outside Linux (there, did I irritate anyone yet?) and Hurd.


...Meanwhile, I'm sticking with X11, and sysvinit (well, and bb init!).

Used FreeBSD quite a bit in the early part of 2000 - 2002 and it was real nice NVidia drivers ran on it.

Linux distro's will probably go whole heartedly into Wayland. Remonescent of how Xfree86 got sidelined.

[TheBlackCat]

I was referring to the lack of "bashing" when I said "way". The idea that they need to convince people that they should treat others kindly is absurd.

First, my point still stands. If Mir ends up being a bad solution, then people have every right to say so. If they feel Mir will hurt the Linux community, they have every right to voice their opinions. If Mir does not seem to be on track to accomplish its goals, it is perfectly acceptable for people to point that out

You have no criticism at all for the Mir devs who opened up, right off the bad, with bashing wayland. This is despite the fact that every single one of their complaints was flat-out wrong and ignorant. But when wayland dares to fire back with criticisms of their criticisms, skepticism of them actually being able to pull of what they claim, and criticism of what they feel will be a negative effect on the Linux ecosystem...oh, it's so terrible, bashing should never happen, why can't we all just get along, the wayland devs should treat the mir devs with kindness. Not a word about the mir devs treating the watland devs the same.

If mir devs didn't want to get in a fight with wayland devs, they shouldn't have picked a fight with them in the first place. You can't go around bashing other development projects then get all offended when they dare to respond to your bashing.

[Triv00ett]

Wayland supports some, but not all, present day Android GPU chipsets.

[JanC]

By the way, Ubuntu officially package Gambas3 yet (sorry, just took a little frustrated jab)

http://packages.ubuntu.com/gambas3

[silix]

<...>If mir devs didn't want to get in a fight with wayland devs, they shouldn't have picked a fight with them in the first place.

i remember the "Mir Spec" page reading "why didnt we consider wayland? because <....> not meet our requirements" - which hardly sounds like picking a fight to me
instead it sounds like a perfectly good (at least civil) rationale for explaining their decision (apart from the fact that they weren't even obliged to write such a "disclaimer" - which may even make it a sign of goodwill on their part)
but those who called developers names for "not having done research", aren't picking up a fight are they?

the mir spec page may contain inaccuracies (like that wayland's input model is similar to that of X), yes
but are you seriously blaming them, with wayland's freedesktop.org website (the official and only credited source *) describing wayland's revolutionary approach (that of merging the display server and the compositor while generating surfaces client side, oh wow) and very little else?
with the need to dwelve in the wayland-devel mailing list for the implementation details and design processes?
with the need, if you're new, to read 4+ years worth of it to reconstruct its evolution from a simple redraw loop to its current state (which even now has things to settle)?
with Xinput2 actually mentioned somewhere as a weston dependency IIRC, because "lets reuse what works"?

* or are you telling one should really dwelve in 4+ years of stuff, scattered among mailing list, phoronix articles, obscure external blogs, to cobble together knowledge about the project named after Aliens' megacorp? seriously?
that's not how a professional would work, for a professional developer only official reference material (possibly books) counts, the rest is fluff

You can't go around bashing other development projects then get all offended when they dare to respond to your bashing.

looks like my definition of bashing and your definition of bashing are quite divergent...
also, consider that there is a thing called ovverreaction - which sometimes may trigger escalation, but usually leaves the one who overreacts less worthy of respect and consideration afterwards, when things have calmed down again...

[silix]

If mir devs didn't want to get in a fight with wayland devs, they shouldn't have picked a fight with them in the first place.

i remember the "Mir Spec" page reading "why didnt we consider wayland? because <....> not meet our requirements"
which hardly sounds like picking a fight to me... instead it sounds like a perfectly good (at least civil) rationale for explaining their decision
disregarding the fact that they weren't even obliged to write such a "disclaimer" in the first place, so it may even be considered a sign of good will on their part
but those who called developers names for "not having done research", aren't picking up a fight, are they?

now, the mir spec page may contain inaccuracies (like that wayland's input model is similar to that of X), yes
but are you seriously blaming them, with wayland's freedesktop.org website (the official and only credited source *) describing wayland's revolutionary (in world encumbered by 30 years of X, for sure) approach (of merging the display server and the compositor while generating surfaces client side, oh wow) and very little else?
with the need to dwelve in the wayland-devel mailing list for implementation details and design processes (if we call debates about this or that function, as such)?
with the need, if you're new, to read 4+ years worth of it to reconstruct its evolution from a simple redraw loop to its current state (with things to settle and standardise even now)?
with Xinput2 IIRC actually mentioned somewhere as a weston dependency, because "lets reuse what works"?

* or are you telling one should really dwelve in 4+ years of stuff, scattered among mailing list, phoronix articles, obscure external blogs, to cobble together knowledge about the project named after Aliens' megacorp? seriously?
that's not how a professional would work, for a professional developer only official reference material (possibly books) counts, the rest is fluff

You can't go around bashing other development projects then get all offended when they dare to respond to your bashing.

looks like my definition of bashing and your definition of bashing are quite divergent
also consider that there is a thing called ovverreaction - which sometimes may trigger escalation, but usually leaves the one who overreacts less worthy of respect and consideration afterwards, when things have calmed down again...

[Hamish Wilson]

http://packages.ubuntu.com/gambas3

Ancient as hell...

[Hamish Wilson]

Snip

I think the idea is they could, as an interested vendor, have asked the Wayland developers for that information (not having to go trawling though old posts). And it was more than just a few inaccuracies, but damn right lies on that page. Whether or they were intentional I do not know, but it is more than enough to justify getting your hackles up.

[finalzone]

Ryao, what happened to eudev?

Look at systemd 197 changelog under contributions.