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Thread: A Note To Canonical: "Don't Piss On Wayland"

  1. #151
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    Quote Originally Posted by dee. View Post
    I wouldn't say significant - they contributed some more code when that hyper-v thing happened but nowdays very little. And Apple only contributes to Webkit only because it's used in Safari, and it's not a Linux component per se, only some browsers use it.
    2012 Linux development report

    Microsoft is #17 in the top 20 companies contributing to Linux, responsible for about 1% of contributions (Google is 1.5%, IBM is 3.7%). Canonical is not on the list at all.

  2. #152
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    Quote Originally Posted by Togga View Post
    I making myself perfectly clear, you are over-interpreting my post with something that were never intended (strawman). The obvious point you now disregard is, as I said, "... as if the community were an organisation that should punish Canonical for lacking trust.". Business areas and methods used may of course differ, but that obvious comparing Cosa Nostra with Wayland right?
    You know the first rule of holes, right? When you are in a hole, stop digging. If you don't want people to think you are a troll, quit with the trolling.

    Pretty much nobody likes doing business with a company they feel has betrayed them. This is not unique to the mafia, it is basic human nature. People tend to avoid associating with people they feel are not trustworthy. The fact that you chose to associate these basic elements of human nature with the mafia shows you are not interested in a reasonable discussion, you are just trolling. If you are not meaning to troll, if you actually want a reasonable discussion, you are going about it the absolutely worst way imaginable.

    Again, you set the tone for what you wrote. You chose your metaphors, you chose your words, you chose your phrasing. You and you alone are responsible for how it was interpreted. People are not psychics. They can only respond to what you wrote, not what you meant to write. It is not a strawman to respond to what you wrote.
    Last edited by TheBlackCat; 03-18-2013 at 04:00 AM.

  3. #153
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    Quote Originally Posted by dee. View Post
    And what are you basing this on?
    For starters, their focus seems to be much more narrow/streamlined than Wayland's....
    Again though, I do wish them both good-luck, & would actually be delighted to see a smartphone platform using Wayland getting something out 1st (or at least not far behind).

  4. #154
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheBlackCat View Post
    You know the first rule of holes, right? When you are in a hole, stop digging. If you don't want people to think you are a troll, quit with the trolling.

    Pretty much nobody likes doing business with a company they feel has betrayed them. This is not unique to the mafia, it is basic human nature. People tend to avoid associating with people they feel are not trustworthy. The fact that you chose to associate these basic elements of human nature with the mafia shows you are not interested in a reasonable discussion, you are just trolling. If you are not meaning to troll, if you actually want a reasonable discussion, you are going about it the absolutely worst way imaginable.

    Again, you set the tone for what you wrote. You chose your metaphors, you chose your words, you chose your phrasing. You and you alone are responsible for how it was interpreted. People are not psychics. They can only respond to what you wrote, not what you meant to write. It is not a strawman to respond to what you wrote.
    +1

    So far this guy's added nothing of substance to the discussion, all he seems to want is the perpetuation of some kind of "us Vs them" narrative.
    The fact is that, what occurred has (justifiably) upset larges sections of the F/OSS community...
    That doesn't mean there's a irrevocable/impassable rift, but it certainly means that Canonical has way more explaining & actions* over the coming mths before concerns are eased.

    *there's still several unclear aspects about their supposedly "open/collaborative" approach towards Mir
    Last edited by jalyst; 03-18-2013 at 06:14 AM. Reason: typo

  5. #155
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheBlackCat View Post
    You know the first rule of holes, right? When you are in a hole, stop digging. If you don't want people to think you are a troll, quit with the trolling.

    Pretty much nobody likes doing business with a company they feel has betrayed them. This is not unique to the mafia, it is basic human nature. People tend to avoid associating with people they feel are not trustworthy. The fact that you chose to associate these basic elements of human nature with the mafia shows you are not interested in a reasonable discussion, you are just trolling. If you are not meaning to troll, if you actually want a reasonable discussion, you are going about it the absolutely worst way imaginable.

    Again, you set the tone for what you wrote. You chose your metaphors, you chose your words, you chose your phrasing. You and you alone are responsible for how it was interpreted. People are not psychics. They can only respond to what you wrote, not what you meant to write. It is not a strawman to respond to what you wrote.
    I think basics in communication between individuals is at least trying to understand the counterparts view. I put two quotes above and clarified my arguments. There is really nothing more to it. My intention was not to do any trolling, my post was a reflection to some of the arguments in this thread.

    My results so far is personal attacks and your off-topic meta-debate about me and my intentions talking about trolls and their tone. I can only conclude that I have touched a sensitive issue.

    I'm not responsible for any twisted interpretations and strawman arguments made from my posts. My post was clearly a personal reflection, noone has asked for clarifications and when I clarified my view it was basically ignored probably because i was tagged with "enemy" to begin with.

  6. #156
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    Quote Originally Posted by Togga View Post
    I think basics in communication between individuals is at least trying to understand the counterparts view. I put two quotes above and clarified my arguments. There is really nothing more to it. My intention was not to do any trolling, my post was a reflection to some of the arguments in this thread.
    Quit dancing around the subject. You compared people who disagreed with you to murders. Period. End of story. That was what you said, that was the context. You claimed to backtrack later, but only after complaining about how mean everyone was to you because they got offended at being compared to murders. And then you turned around and admitted that yes you were comparing them to murders, but only because they didn't want to work with with people they didn't trust, as though this was some sort of bizarre, deviant reaction that only murders would have.

    Your whining about personal attacks is highly disingenuous when your very first post was an extremely vicious personal attack far beyond anything you have received in reply.

    So no, sorry, zero sympathy. People got offended by you when you blatantly insulted them, and they lashed back. That is all that happened here. Any half-sane person would know what sort of reaction they would get when comparing perfectly ordinary, normal human reactions to the behavior of murders. Your surprise at this either means you are being dishonest (i.e. a troll), or you have absolutely no clue whatsoever how to interact with other human beings. Neither case is someone I want to waste any more time with. Go ahead, play the martyr card. I don't care anymore. Everyone reading can read what your opening post was. You aren't fooling anyone.

  7. #157
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheBlackCat View Post
    Quit dancing around the subject. You compared people who disagreed with you to murders. Period. End of story. That was what you said, that was the context. You claimed to backtrack later, but only after complaining about how mean everyone was to you because they got offended at being compared to murders. And then you turned around and admitted that yes you were comparing them to murders, but only because they didn't want to work with with people they didn't trust, as though this was some sort of bizarre, deviant reaction that only murders would have.

    Your whining about personal attacks is highly disingenuous when your very first post was an extremely vicious personal attack far beyond anything you have received in reply.

    So no, sorry, zero sympathy. People got offended by you when you blatantly insulted them, and they lashed back. That is all that happened here. Any half-sane person would know what sort of reaction they would get when comparing perfectly ordinary, normal human reactions to the behavior of murders. Your surprise at this either means you are being dishonest (i.e. a troll), or you have absolutely no clue whatsoever how to interact with other human beings. Neither case is someone I want to waste any more time with. Go ahead, play the martyr card. I don't care anymore. Everyone reading can read what your opening post was. You aren't fooling anyone.
    This is probably the most energy i've ever seen put on a strawman show, trying to make a person look bad completely ignoring what that person is trying to say.

    Our "discussion" is leading nowhere more than that I can add "hostile environment" to my Mafia analogy. Thanks. I'll certaintly giving Mir a real try in future projects. Have a nice day.

  8. #158
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    Quote Originally Posted by Togga View Post
    This is probably the most energy i've ever seen put on a strawman show, trying to make a person look bad completely ignoring what that person is trying to say.

    Our "discussion" is leading nowhere more than that I can add "hostile environment" to my Mafia analogy. Thanks. I'll certaintly giving Mir a real try in future projects. Have a nice day.
    OMFG, the cluelessness is astounding, by all means pick your little "team/side", those of us with more between the ears will use/appreciate both for what they're targeted for, & will contribute.

  9. #159
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    Quote Originally Posted by BO$$ View Post
    Sorry fedora openSuse arch and all others but you had no chance to be competitive. All you could do was try to hang on Canonical for as long as you could but your arrogance and ignorance kept you from doing that. Ubuntu is going up and you will inevitably go down into oblivion.
    Comparing:
    Opensuse vs Ubuntu? When you once try opensuse, you'll know how good it is.
    Arch vs Ubuntu? Well, with arch, at least, I don't have to reinstall every 6 months
    Debian vs Ubuntu? Debian have stability and upgrade-ability the latter don't.

    Quote Originally Posted by Togga View Post
    Our "discussion" is leading nowhere more than that I can add "hostile environment" to my Mafia analogy. Thanks. I'll certaintly giving Mir a real try in future projects. Have a nice day.
    Language lesson: When you try to make an analogy, say it like this, children: "I don't know that FLOSS like a mafia organisation." Don't say it like this, ok? "I didn't know that FLOSS was a mafia organisation." That two have different meaning. Got it, children? Good boy!

    Oh, and Togga, cause you know about this wayland vs mir case, can you describe it for me? Why wayland devs and the rest angry at canonical? 'Cause you're quite informative, based on your argument
    Last edited by t.s.; 03-22-2013 at 12:53 AM.

  10. #160
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    Quote Originally Posted by t.s. View Post
    Comparing:
    Opensuse vs Ubuntu? When you once try opensuse, you'll know how good it is.
    Arch vs Ubuntu? Well, with arch, at least, I don't have to reinstall every 6 months
    Debian vs Ubuntu? Debian have stability and upgrade-ability the latter don't.
    openSUSE is simply too buggy for desktop. I regretted the day when I almost lost Linux adoption in the family when installed openSUSE instead of Ubuntu :P
    Arch can break any time you do pacman -Su
    And Debian is way too rusty.

    Quote Originally Posted by t.s. View Post
    Why wayland devs and the rest angry at canonical? 'Cause you're quite informative, based on your argument
    Errr... because the rest is employed by or supported by Red Hat which happens to be competition.

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