Page 2 of 4 FirstFirst 1234 LastLast
Results 11 to 20 of 40

Thread: Wayland Still Working On Minimizing, Maximizing

  1. #11
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Rural Alberta, Canada
    Posts
    1,030

    Default

    Now, I do not wish for this to become another thread just like all of the others, but I do find it a tad rich that people are complaining about Micheal's journalism here now just because he is being a little gruff about Canonical, when many of you all failed to rise or complain when he trash-talked the new Anaconda, LGP or whatever else he has failed to take a shine to. Michael is just being Michael, and if you could put up with it then, you can put up with it now.

  2. #12
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    NYC
    Posts
    11

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Hamish Wilson View Post
    Now, I do not wish for this to become another thread just like all of the others, but I do find it a tad rich that people are complaining about Micheal's journalism here now just because he is being a little gruff about Canonical, when many of you all failed to rise or complain when he trash-talked the new Anaconda, LGP or whatever else he has failed to take a shine to. Michael is just being Michael, and if you could put up with it then, you can put up with it now.
    How many negative articles were posted about Anaconda? Or on LGP? Are you serious? Here are the Mir articles for the last week:

    KWin On Mir: A Solution To Non-Existent Problem
    Canonical Loses Work From Top Compiz Contributor
    Shuttleworth On Mir: "A Fantastic Piece of Engineering"
    Mark Shuttleworth Goes Blogging On Ubuntu Defense
    Ubuntu 13.04 Won't Get X.Org Server 1.14 [because of mir!]
    Videos Of Unity Running On Mir Via X Server
    Canonical Announces Mir Back-End For Mainline Mesa
    A Note To Canonical: "Don't Piss On Wayland"
    Building & Running The Ubuntu Mir Display Server
    The Developers Behind The Mir Display Server
    Upstream X/Wayland Developers Bash Canonical, Mir
    Ubuntu Announces Mir, A X.Org/Wayland Replacement

    YHBT. Heck, IHBT. In any case... HAND!

  3. #13
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    880

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by marrusl View Post
    How many negative articles were posted about Anaconda? Or on LGP? Are you serious? Here are the Mir articles for the last week:

    KWin On Mir: A Solution To Non-Existent Problem
    Canonical Loses Work From Top Compiz Contributor
    Shuttleworth On Mir: "A Fantastic Piece of Engineering"
    Mark Shuttleworth Goes Blogging On Ubuntu Defense
    Ubuntu 13.04 Won't Get X.Org Server 1.14 [because of mir!]
    Videos Of Unity Running On Mir Via X Server
    Canonical Announces Mir Back-End For Mainline Mesa
    A Note To Canonical: "Don't Piss On Wayland"
    Building & Running The Ubuntu Mir Display Server
    The Developers Behind The Mir Display Server
    Upstream X/Wayland Developers Bash Canonical, Mir
    Ubuntu Announces Mir, A X.Org/Wayland Replacement

    YHBT. Heck, IHBT. In any case... HAND!
    Hi you must be new here, otherwise you would know exactly what Hamish is talking about. If you follow Phoronix on a regular basis at all you'd know that he pretty much bashes on everything except for technologies he happens to be favoring at the moment, You want to see him really bashing find an article on the Radeon Southern Islands support...

    However of your list let's mark out how many are interpretations/reposts of people blogs and thus are essentially newsworthy in that regard:
    KWin On Mir: A Solution To Non-Existent Problem
    Canonical Loses Work From Top Compiz Contributor
    Shuttleworth On Mir: "A Fantastic Piece of Engineering"
    Mark Shuttleworth Goes Blogging On Ubuntu Defense
    A Note To Canonical: "Don't Piss On Wayland"
    Upstream X/Wayland Developers Bash Canonical, Mir
    and how many of these are announcement / initial testing of Mir and are essentially all on Larabel:
    Videos Of Unity Running On Mir Via X Server
    Building & Running The Ubuntu Mir Display Server
    Ubuntu Announces Mir, A X.Org/Wayland Replacement
    The Developers Behind The Mir Display Server
    and what's left? well an announcement on Xorg.. The only reason the number of posts here is slightly higher than average in terms of Mir is essentially due to the fact that Larabel summarizes blog posts by influential people. That they're negative reflects the overall negative reaction towards canonical by the related bloggers, and it's not like they're without reason, Canonical played foul and the larger community has reacted against them as a result.

    Do note that Larabel has been accused of favouring Ubuntu before in the past due to his almost exclusive use for it for benchmarking. What I would like to know is where are all of these canonical (not even fanboys really for ubuntu but canonical) fanboys coming from? Is Shuttleworth secretly setting up raids on Phoronix with his other skunkworks projects?

    Edit: and actually reviewing the related all on larabel posts I'd see he really wasn't being that negative at all on those
    Last edited by Luke_Wolf; 03-09-2013 at 03:06 AM.

  4. #14
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    683

    Default

    Sound like flawed proposal.

    Why use "minimize" ??

    Why not "your input / focus / drawing surface" changed?

    And why not separate "your drawing surface is invisible for now" ? (With additional "give us one frame preatty please"?)

  5. #15
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    459

    Default

    It would be nice to have more than just minimize and maximize.
    Support for custom things so Wayland does not dictate in any way what kinds of window changes there are. Makes it possible to not have to change protocols when doing other things:
    http://www.4t-niagara.com/tray.html

    Personally I don't like the idea of minimize might see something on taskbar.
    Would like a minimize-taskbar and minimize-tray action for that.

    Don't consider Wayland in a post 1.0 state when this is not done yet.
    I understand it takes a long time to design it well but there should be no shame in not doing a 1.0 release yet.

  6. #16
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Posts
    527

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by przemoli View Post
    Sound like flawed proposal.

    Why use "minimize" ??

    Why not "your input / focus / drawing surface" changed?

    And why not separate "your drawing surface is invisible for now" ? (With additional "give us one frame preatty please"?)
    Something like this. In a generic world, you would only ever tell the app what size the draw surface is, and that is it - an app should just infer 0x0 as being hidden, and just needs metrics to ask "am I minimized?", "am I as big as I can get?" "am I as big as the entire screen?" but the app would ask those questions, it wouldn't be told them, because that isn't inherently necessary information.

    I imagine it would be the responsibility of a toolkit to capture the state of an app prior to a minimize and store it as a preview. It shouldn't be an applications responsibility to generate those snapshot images.

    Though hidden seems like a reasonable compromise. Maybe even "max size". I wonder, is Wayland going to implement awful separate fullscreen app context behavior like X, where fullscreen apps basically crap all over the window system, and have "fullscreen" just be a borderless window, or keep that awful mechanism? A smart DE should just suppress updates if the entire display is captured by an app in chromeless mode.

  7. #17
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Switzerland
    Posts
    18

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by BO$$ View Post
    Hahaha the Wayland that is done, that is version 1.0, released, the greatest thing ever so good it's not in any distro since nobody deserves them, couldn't minimize? Sure, Wayland is complete...riiight...
    Who said Wayland is complete? (Beside you.)

  8. #18
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Posts
    3

    Default

    Shouldn't this be handled completely by the window manager?

  9. #19
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Switzerland
    Posts
    18

    Default like Sinatra, canonical might sing: "...and do it my way."

    This shows how long it takes to design and implement well a full-featured modern display server, with Wayland having been developed for about five years now while Canonical hopes Mir will be ready by later in the year and ready for all form-factors by next April.
    Well, they might do it the canonical way. Take all the hard work from others - eg take the Wayland solution of how this minimize thing has been solved - , put some ubuntu sauce on it, so it can't be used anywhere else and call it their own, superior Mir solution.

    Just a thought.

  10. #20
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    48

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by rgloor View Post
    Well, they might do it the canonical way. Take all the hard work from others - eg take the Wayland solution of how this minimize thing has been solved - , put some ubuntu sauce on it, so it can't be used anywhere else and call it their own, superior Mir solution.

    Just a thought.
    less coolness pls
    first, i supposed that leveraging the hard work from others (so that you can "stand on the shoulders of giants") was the whole point of the GPL - now becomes a crime?
    second, AFAIK (correct me if im wrong) Wayland puts much window management awareness onto clients, and involves communication between clients, the WM and the compositor) involving - whereas if i understand it correctly, Mir wants to achieve single process operation and as transparent window management as possible - that sais diametrically opposite approaches to me

    thus, if wayland code is looked at (difficult, going tdd implies writing one testcase > one code line > one testcase > one code line, thus only ad hoc code ends up in place) that would be for the basics (like the redraw loop) or as a reference how not to do things

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •