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Thread: Bitcoin Mining Comes To Radeon Open-Source OpenCL

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fenrin View Post
    I am interested in digital currencies and mining of it. [*]AMD GPU's are more efficient at mining than Nvidia GPU's
    "Efficient" probably depends on your definition of the word. If you mean "bitcoins/initial cost" this may be true, but you should probably also regard "bitcoins/running cost", so take performance/watt into account. Afaik, unless you get power for free mining bitcoins is actually fairly unattractive in most countries by now. Also, be wary of people linking to Litecoins: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-22120833.

    Not really a fan of the whole Bitcoin business, reeks too much of a "get rich quick" scheme.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wildfire View Post
    Afaik, unless you get power for free mining bitcoins is actually fairly unattractive in most countries by now.
    Only if you sell the bitcoins immediately after mining. If you speculate that the exchange rate will increase further then maybe not.
    Quote Originally Posted by Wildfire View Post
    Also, be wary of people linking to Litecoins: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-22120833.
    Um, be wary of downloading and installing programs from unknown sources? You don't say.

    Litecoin itself is a good addition to electronic money. One of the dangers that may bring down Bitcoin is if someone finds a weakness in the protocol or cryptography. For that reason, having many different currencies and not betting everything on one horse is preferable. (Similar to central banks' often diverse currency reserves)

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wildfire View Post
    "Efficient" probably depends on your definition of the word. If you mean "bitcoins/initial cost" this may be true, but you should probably also regard "bitcoins/running cost", so take performance/watt into account. Afaik, unless you get power for free mining bitcoins is actually fairly unattractive in most countries by now. Also, be wary of people linking to Litecoins: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-22120833.

    Not really a fan of the whole Bitcoin business, reeks too much of a "get rich quick" scheme.
    well after my last post I looked a bit more into it, if it even would be worth it to mine Litecoins. At energy costs greater than about a half euro per kWh, minig is less intersting than buying LTC or BTC with real euros.

    At energy costs at about 40 cents/kWh LTC mining could be interesting with efficient hardware (such as Radeon HD 7770 or 7790 and efficient PSU etc.). But probably only if the computer would be turned on anyways for casual not GPU intense tasks and if the hardware is already paid.

    If anyone is interested in LTC mining, the following links are useful to research if one can profit from it.
    to get the hashrate of the hardware:
    https://github.com/litecoin-project/...are-comparison

    determine the generation rate, via hashrate and difficulty of LTC coining:
    http://litecoinminingcalculator.com/

    value of Litecoins:
    http://www.cryptocoincharts.info/

    then calculate the energy costs...

    why I think LTC, BTC is intersting:
    * people loose faith in their government currencies so it is likely that these currencies will raise in the long term - except if several governments forbid BTC, LTC trading somewhen
    * no trading fees like with PayPal, etc.
    Last edited by Fenrin; 04-13-2013 at 04:57 PM.

  4. #24
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    Enjoy your next bubble folks! Don't say i didn't warn ya!

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fenrin View Post
    well after my last post I looked a bit more into it, if it even would be worth it to mine Litecoins.
    Even more important for the decision for or against mining Litecoins is whether it is even possible. bfgminer folks have been actively cooperating to make bitcoin mining work with the free software stack.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by chithanh View Post
    Only if you sell the bitcoins immediately after mining. If you speculate that the exchange rate will increase further then maybe not.
    That's stupid. You could buy those same bitcoins today for less than by mining them, and sell those bitcoin later at the exact same price as if you would have mined them.

    If you mine at a loss today, it's at a loss forever. That's like saying, I'll get that lesser paid job instead of the same, better paid one, because then I'll speculate with the money I'll earn, and I'll be rich.

    All in all, if you make your investment decisions like that, you probably shouldn't speculate.

  7. #27
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    By "mining bitcoins" you essentially spend your computer resources and electricity to secure the digital money transactions over bitcoin.
    So, the "coins" which you get is your compensation for making transactions system secure.
    Nothing more. This is proven by bitcoin limit.

    Ponzi scheme or bubbles have no relation to that.
    Ponzi is using existing money to advertise new payers, money of which would be used to cover tomorrow costs.
    Applied to bitcoin, it would mean that tomorrow mining will earn you more, than today. But it is not happening, because the number of bitcoins is limited, so is limited the need to cryptographically protect the system. For this protection, money is paid ("mining"). But there is limit in protection, when its not worthy anymore. Should system expand and find more money transfer cases, so will demand for cryptography increase and people will join in. Thats self regulation.

    Its not bubble, because bubble would be making promises. There are no promises in bitcoin, and money is paid in exchange for making it secure. This is exactly equivalent to the amount PayPal requests from each money reciever, to make system secure and insured.

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prescience500 View Post
    Bitcoin is NOT a ponzi scheme like the Dollar or the Euro because there's a finite number of them that can ever exist. Central banks can go on a printing spree like the Weimar Republic. The Bitcoin Foundation can't.
    Well, as CPU/GPU development advances the ceiling limit of Bitcoin may have to be readjusted periodically as hashes that were previously unable to be mined in any reasonable time would be in reach.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by chithanh View Post
    Only if you sell the bitcoins immediately after mining. If you speculate that the exchange rate will increase further then maybe not.
    Sure, but think about it this way: if you mine Bitcoins worth 200 while racking up an energy bill worth 400 you'll have to gain at least 200 before you break even. And this isn't even taking things like inflation into account. And since Bitcoins are speculative their worth may or may not reach this goal in the foreseeable future.

    It's a bit like stock trading, I've you've got the money and you can live with the possible loss of your investment, go for it. But given the current (in)stability of our economy I'd rather not invest in a virtual currency that might not be worth anything if it comes to the worst. Or do you think the bakery around the corner is gonna sell you bread for Bitcoins? (Yeah yeah, I know I'm exaggerating, but still...)

    Anyway let's get some realistic numbers in here: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-22153687

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by erendorn View Post
    That's stupid. You could buy those same bitcoins today for less than by mining them, and sell those bitcoin later at the exact same price as if you would have mined them.
    If you mine at a loss today, it's at a loss forever. That's like saying, I'll get that lesser paid job instead of the same, better paid one, because then I'll speculate with the money I'll earn, and I'll be rich.
    You are assuming that only the price of bitcoins versus the electricity cost matters. Unfortunately, it's not as easy as that.

    One difference between mining and buying is that usually you don't pay the electricity bill right away. Depending on your utility contract, the actual use will be billed once per month or even once per year. So you can rack up the kWh now and pay later.
    Secondly, in order to buy bitcoins you have to disclose certain information (like bank account, credit card) and make a payment. This involves risks. If you only mine, then nobody needs to know who you are until you sell the bitcoins.

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