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Thread: Gentoo Starts Work On KDE-Wayland Support

  1. #41
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    X applications will continue to run, but only in some kind of emulation inside Mir. So how well the graphics drivers drive Mir, and how well the frameworks/toolkits work under that emulation will be very essential. Even if not a single line of application code is Mir-specific.

  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by chithanh View Post
    X applications will continue to run, but only in some kind of emulation inside Mir. So how well the graphics drivers drive Mir, and how well the frameworks/toolkits work under that emulation will be very essential. Even if not a single line of application code is Mir-specific.

    Not really... Both Mir And Wayland handle x-apps the same way. via XMir and XWayland respectively wherein each X-App gets its own private X-server, that it thinks is in control of the hardware and when it thinks its displaying the buffers its actually pushing them to Wayland or Mir surface and then Wayland or Mir handles the actual displaying
    XMir and Xwayland are no more emulators than Wine and even THATS a bad example

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by chithanh View Post
    X applications will continue to run, but only in some kind of emulation inside Mir. So how well the graphics drivers drive Mir, and how well the frameworks/toolkits work under that emulation will be very essential. Even if not a single line of application code is Mir-specific.
    That's not true, and just goes to show that you don't really know what you're talking about.

    Even if it were, that would be Ubuntu's problem to make everything work. Not Valve's. They need all sorts of legacy X applications, not just a single vendor.
    Last edited by smitty3268; 06-23-2013 at 06:12 PM.

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by chithanh View Post
    Some Red Hat / SUSE customers might have decided to start developing games for Steam following the announcement from Valve.

    And even if Valve doesn't care about Mir at all in their code, they (and their graphics partners) will still have to deal with it because Ubuntu uses it as default graphics system.
    That sounds too improvised to be likely. Possible, sure, but likely? I don't think so.

  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by smitty3268 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by chithanh View Post
    X applications will continue to run, but only in some kind of emulation inside Mir. So how well the graphics drivers drive Mir, and how well the frameworks/toolkits work under that emulation will be very essential. Even if not a single line of application code is Mir-specific.
    That's not true, and just goes to show that you don't really know what you're talking about..
    Xmir is an X11 server running on top of the Mir compositor.
    http://bregmatter.wordpress.com/2013...p-convergence/

    So any performance issues with Mir will possibly translate to performance issues in Xmir.
    Quote Originally Posted by smitty3268 View Post
    Even if it were, that would be Ubuntu's problem to make everything work. Not Valve's. They need all sorts of legacy X applications, not just a single vendor.
    The problem is Valve's too, because Ubuntu is their preferred distro. And by extension, it becomes AMD's and NVidia's problem to make Mir perform well on their hardware, or else Xmir won't perform well, and thus Steam may not perform well.

  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by chithanh View Post
    So any performance issues with Mir will possibly translate to performance issues in Xmir.
    The problem is Valve's too, because Ubuntu is their preferred distro. And by extension, it becomes AMD's and NVidia's problem to make Mir perform well on their hardware, or else Xmir won't perform well, and thus Steam may not perform well.
    The same way Canonical changed its mind respect Mir several times (fixed protocol, not fixed protocol, etc), Valve is free to change its mind when Mir is out there if they consider Mir unsuitable (or the need to support X greater than the need to support Mir, and supporting both is considered too much burden).

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    Quote Originally Posted by chithanh View Post
    The problem is Valve's too, because Ubuntu is their preferred distro.
    It is an easy problem for them to solve: change their preferred distro. The fact that they claim right now Ubuntu is the easiest to target, doesn't mean they are forced to stick with Ubuntu if it starts causing them trouble down the road.

    Quote Originally Posted by chithanh View Post
    And by extension, it becomes AMD's and NVidia's problem to make Mir perform well on their hardware, or else Xmir won't perform well, and thus Steam may not perform well.
    That is only an issue if steam on Linux becomes a major source of revenue for them. So far it isn't.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheBlackCat View Post
    It is an easy problem for them to solve: change their preferred distro. The fact that they claim right now Ubuntu is the easiest to target, doesn't mean they are forced to stick with Ubuntu if it starts causing them trouble down the road.
    Valve may stick a different distro into their Steam box, that is true. However, Ubuntu and its derivatives have all but marginalized the other desktop distros. So any change in distro support is going to be a tough sell.
    I give to you that not all Ubuntu derivatives are going to follow to Mir, so some uncertainty remains here.
    Quote Originally Posted by TheBlackCat View Post
    That is only an issue if steam on Linux becomes a major source of revenue for them. So far it isn't.
    If you read the Phoronix article I linked in a previous post, NVidia already cares about Steam gaming performance on Linux:
    Quote Originally Posted by http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=nvidia_r310_linux
    This week NVIDIA began advertising their new "R310" Linux graphics driver that "delivers [a] massive performance boost to Linux gaming" as a result of Valve releasing their Steam Linux Beta.
    I think you can't get more explicit than that.

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