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Thread: Fedora 20 Might No Longer Install Syslog

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by liam View Post
    ...or, you know, the man pages? journald.conf isn't exactly like the gcc entry

    Systemd related tools have phenomenal official documentation. I wish all projects were as them when it comes to docs.
    Wiki's are more likely to have specific examples, which is useful for when the documentation is unclear

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ericg View Post
    Wiki's are more likely to have specific examples, which is useful for when the documentation is unclear
    Hey, I'm not against wikis, esp Arch/gentoo wikis, but the systemd man pages are just soooo good.
    I feel like I'm gushing a bit, but I'm just used to really poorly written "blueprints" which don't even document all the features for the given utility.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by liam View Post
    Hey, I'm not against wikis, esp Arch/gentoo wikis, but the systemd man pages are just soooo good.
    I feel like I'm gushing a bit, but I'm just used to really poorly written "blueprints" which don't even document all the features for the given utility.
    Oh I'm not disagreeing that systemd's man pages aren't good. But in my experience with man pages they are the exception, not the rule :/

  4. #24
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    So how can i backup journald logs?
    How come that journal is 5.9M while it contains just 44 entries

    [root@localhost journal]# du -h
    5.9M ./fbb0c4896a9c0f680475c0a07edd2c5a
    5.9M .

    And btw reducing log size also removed a lot of logs but instead of keeping the newest logs im left garbage from 6 days

  5. #25
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    In my experience, if your log files are in a binary format then you are doing it wrong (TM).
    Especially on Linux, you have just thrown all the traditional text processing tools (sed, grep etc) out the window.

    There are ways to index text files for faster access etc. It's also easy to limit the size of the log file, or just create a new file whenever the size reaches a certain limit.

    Now I will need a special tool just to read the log file? Microsoft went down that alley, and failed. Log files on Windows are horrible and inaccessible. Don't do that to Linux.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by amehaye View Post
    In my experience, if your log files are in a binary format then you are doing it wrong (TM).
    Doing it wrong? Different is not wrong; there are some good arguments for binary logs, mostly related to security.

    The only question here is what Fedora does by default, and honestly, who cares? Nothing is stopping you from using a different system logger, all messages are forwarded to a socket at /run/systemd/journal/syslog. You can tell journalctl not to store logs and have your syslog daemon listen on that socket, or you can run both. If you're unable to make these changes, chances are that you're unable to actually make use of the text logs, too.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ramiliez View Post
    So how can i backup journald logs?
    How come that journal is 5.9M while it contains just 44 entries

    [root@localhost journal]# du -h
    5.9M ./fbb0c4896a9c0f680475c0a07edd2c5a
    5.9M .

    And btw reducing log size also removed a lot of logs but instead of keeping the newest logs im left garbage from 6 days
    Your log file directory is named with a list of a thousand random hex chars? Gee... where have we seen this before?

    Quote Originally Posted by amehaye View Post
    In my experience, if your log files are in a binary format then you are doing it wrong (TM).
    Exactly. I still remember leafing through MS's Log File Viewer just to find some half-helpful information. I'd prefer to forget about the experience altogether.

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ramiliez View Post
    So how can i backup journald logs?
    How come that journal is 5.9M while it contains just 44 entries

    [root@localhost journal]# du -h
    5.9M ./fbb0c4896a9c0f680475c0a07edd2c5a
    5.9M .

    And btw reducing log size also removed a lot of logs but instead of keeping the newest logs im left garbage from 6 days
    Odd but regardless, checking the journald.conf man page also adds in this line

    MaxRetentionSec=

    0 is the default (which turns it off) Journal entries older than the specified time limit (in seconds) will be automatically deleted. You may append "year" "month" "week" "day" "h" or "m" to over ride the default time unit of seconds.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnc View Post
    Your log file directory is named with a list of a thousand random hex chars? Gee... where have we seen this before?



    Exactly. I still remember leafing through MS's Log File Viewer just to find some half-helpful information. I'd prefer to forget about the experience altogether.
    Remember 1 min shutdown time on Windows? they have it too and also there's another issue when you have entry in fstab Hard Driver for example and you physically unplugged it systemd will just refuses to let you log in

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by amehaye View Post
    In my experience, if your log files are in a binary format then you are doing it wrong (TM).
    Especially on Linux, you have just thrown all the traditional text processing tools (sed, grep etc) out the window.

    There are ways to index text files for faster access etc. It's also easy to limit the size of the log file, or just create a new file whenever the size reaches a certain limit.

    Now I will need a special tool just to read the log file? Microsoft went down that alley, and failed. Log files on Windows are horrible and inaccessible. Don't do that to Linux.
    This special tool gives you text output in the standard format, which you can pipe to all the traditional text processing tools (hey, even to a text file! wow!)

    Anyway, this has been lengthily debated, and journal is here to stay, as the main logging mechanism for fedora (and some other distributions).
    The current debate is not whether journal is good, nor whether it should be used by default, nor whether other logging systems should or could be made incompatible.
    It is about making it the only one installed by default, as opposed to (previously) one of two mechanisms installed by default.

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