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Thread: XMir Lands In Ubuntu 13.10 Main

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by LinuxGamer View Post
    Lets hope this happens XWayland integration

    http://www.x.org/wiki/Releases/7.8/
    Aye. I've read some articles from earlier this year, stating that xorg-server 1.13 should have XWayland merged, and that it should release in September. The link you provided made no such promises though. I really hope to see some EGL support from proprietary drivers at the time that XWayland is merged, if not sooner.
    I have doubts that we'll see any EGL on Catalyst any time soon, but the Radeon drivers seem to mature pretty well.

    Regarding Wayland DE's, as I've said before, I wouldn't be surprised to see full Wayland DE's much earlier than mid 2014. I think we'll see at least a few fully functional DE's using Weston within 5 months.
    Also, if memory serves, I seem to recall Gnome promising full Wayland integration during spring 2014 (can't remember the exact month).

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by LinuxGamer View Post
    and what a lot of trolls don't get is that we're going to be able to use Wayland this year in Development release's Mir will not be used tell Ubuntu 14.10
    That is wrong.
    Mir will be used in 13.10, Desktop and Touch.
    Then again Unity8 will not be ready until 14.10 Desktop Edition, hence Unity7 will run with XMir until Unity8 is ready for the desktop.

    So in truth, the Wayland fanboys are the reality twisters.

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by sacridex View Post
    That is wrong.
    Mir will be used in 13.10, Desktop and Touch.
    Then again Unity8 will not be ready until 14.10 Desktop Edition, hence Unity7 will run with XMir until Unity8 is ready for the desktop.

    So in truth, the Wayland fanboys are the reality twisters.
    Yeah that's bullshit. Running on XMir is the same as running on plain X, except that it's slower and has crappier driver support. Mir will not run natively until next year. Let's hope Canonical comes to its senses by then and abandons this silly project.

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by sacridex View Post
    That is wrong.
    Mir will be used in 13.10, Desktop and Touch.
    Then again Unity8 will not be ready until 14.10 Desktop Edition, hence Unity7 will run with XMir until Unity8 is ready for the desktop.

    So in truth, the Wayland fanboys are the reality twisters.
    There's a patch somewhere that allows you to do exactly the same with Wayland. It was just never accepted upstream cause running a X DE on top of a complatiblity layer is, according to the XWayland (and as such XMir, too) devs, plain stupid.

    So in fact Mir fanboys are not only reality twisters but also plain stupid...

  5. #15
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    As far as I know, there is still some flaw in XWayland that needs to be fixed. I heard they are waiting for DRI 3000 for some reason. I'm sure they'll have it included in X11 by the time the first full wayland desktops are ready.

  6. #16
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    Regardless of any perceived superiority in Wayland, Mir is the one with big backing. Canonical can go to AMD and nVidia and get special drivers made when XOrg cannot. Canonical and Valve are in partnership so games will be ported to Mir, etc. Ubuntu is the defacto Linux OS, it has easily the largest install base, it has users that are not technologically minded and will not care in the slightest about Mir vs Wayland.

    Being best is not winning and it never has been.

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by scottishduck View Post
    Regardless of any perceived superiority in Wayland, Mir is the one with big backing. Canonical can go to AMD and nVidia and get special drivers made when XOrg cannot. Canonical and Valve are in partnership so games will be ported to Mir, etc. Ubuntu is the defacto Linux OS, it has easily the largest install base, it has users that are not technologically minded and will not care in the slightest about Mir vs Wayland.

    Being best is not winning and it never has been.
    Big backing from the company that has to beg for money from their users to get a phone made?

    Anyway, you're clearly talking about things you don't know about. That's the problem with blind fanboyism. Ubuntu has, at most, 30-40% of the market share of home-user desktop Linux systems. All of the rest will be using Wayland eventually, while Mir will only run on Ubuntu. That means that Mir will have the minority market share compared to Wayland. The real money for GPU makers is not in Ubuntu, which is pretty minuscule compared to the actually profitable markets - render farms and workstations, which will not run Ubuntu. Most of them run RHEL which will be using Wayland.

    Even if what you said were true - which it isn't - there would be no such thing as "Mir drivers" or "Wayland drivers". There will be EGL-drivers. Mir requires EGL to render. Wayland is backend-agnostic, and can run on a variety of backends - including Android drivers or pure software rendering. Even if GPU-manufacturers were to make only Mir-compatible drivers (which, again, won't happen because EGL), it would be trivial to write a Wayland-backend to use those drivers.

    Also, want to talk about "big backing"? Wayland is backed by Intel, Red Hat, Collabora, Samsung, Jolla... now what were you saying about "big backing"?

    Games potentially being ported to Mir is exactly the reason why Mir is so disruptive and needs to die as soon as possible. It's a dirty power-grab by Canonical and shows how blind their fanboys can be. If Microsoft did the same, everyone would be up at arms at how evil they are, trying to implement vendor lock-in and exclude others from the market. Canonical does it and suddenly they're the "grand innovator". Yeah right...

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by uid313 View Post
    Yes, I know.
    But it is the old version.
    They pull from Debian testing or unstable, I don't remember which. But the version Ubuntu has is the same as that Debian one. Its not a conspiracy to keep Wayland down. I'm not paid by Canonical. I'm just a guy with knowledge.

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by scottishduck View Post
    Regardless of any perceived superiority in Wayland, Mir is the one with big backing.
    Canonical is in the red, while Intel and Red Hat are on the rise. They back Wayland.

    Canonical can go to AMD and nVidia and get special drivers made when XOrg cannot.
    And you base this claim on what? Blobs were there before Ubuntu existed.

    Canonical and Valve are in partnership so games will be ported to Mir, etc.
    Valve is in partnership with Valve into providing a Linux based console. The Ubuntu thing might be a partnership, or it might be beta testing.

    Ubuntu is the defacto Linux OS, it has easily the largest install base, it has users that are not technologically minded and will not care in the slightest about Mir vs Wayland.

    Being best is not winning and it never has been.
    On this, we agree. That doesn't make it better in the slightest.

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by scottishduck View Post
    Regardless of any perceived superiority in Wayland, Mir is the one with big backing. Canonical can go to AMD and nVidia and get special drivers made when XOrg cannot. Canonical and Valve are in partnership so games will be ported to Mir, etc. Ubuntu is the defacto Linux OS, it has easily the largest install base, it has users that are not technologically minded and will not care in the slightest about Mir vs Wayland.

    Being best is not winning and it never has been.
    You are vastly overestimating Canonicals power. They have none. They pretty much have to do whatever their business partners want them to do. Canonical is a tiny company that isn't even making a profit. RedHat could buy Canonical 10 times. NVIDIA is making money on workstation. That's why they even have drivers for FreeBSD and even Solaris. Ubuntu isn't really significant for them. There will never be such a thing as a "Mir driver" anyway. Games will also still use SDL like they do know. It's more likely that Wayland support in SDL will be upstreamed than Mir. At least the wayland SDL branch seems to be usable.

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